Emails, letters, and scandal, seem to be circling Mr. Angelo Mozilo has he scurries to cover up when the light is exposed on his famously tanned hide.
The light flips on and BAM! Out goes the Countrywide Freeze Super Hero’s who are paid by Mozilo to fix PR problems, and put muzzles on homeowers who may expose what really is going on with their bad loans and soon to be foreclosed homes.
What turned out to be the most famous hardship letter ever written in the history of foreclosure mania, has turned into the most famous email reply ever written.
The exchange between Dan Bailey and Mr. Mozilo was a classic tale of the little guy going up against a Goliath of a corporation known as Countrywide Home Loans. The email gave us all an inside look at what one of the most powerful CEO’s in the world, thinks of Homeowner Joe, who is strapped to the hilt and reaching out for help to save his home.
Angelo_Mozilo@countrywide.com wrote:
This is unbelievable. Most of these letters now have the same wording. Obviously they are being counseled by some other person or by the internet. Disgusting.
Mozilo and the Countrywide camp then released this email in response to the LA Times repeated requests for comment:
Bailey and Mozilo couldn’t be reached for comment. Late in the day, the lender issued this statement: “Countrywide and Mr. Mozilo regret any misunderstanding caused by his inadvertent response to an e-mail by Mr. Bailey. Countrywide is actively working to help borrowers, like Mr. Bailey, keep their homes.”
Shortly thereafter the Countrywide Freeze Super Hero came in and went to work on Mr. Dan Bailey.
The hero instructed Dan not to speak with the media and that they are all bad guys looking to exploit you for their gain. He also told Dan that he would get the best loan of his homeowner life, and that they would expedite him through the loan modification process.
But, Mr. Bailey was told that if he spoke with the media or anyone about what the freeze super hero was speaking of, then all bets are off and he will lose his home. Oh and to top it off, Dan was told he must sign a confidentiality agreement that is legally binding.
Wow, the best loan of his life and all he has to do is keep quiet.
What good ‘ole North Carolina boy would turn an offer down like that? Not Dan, heck, he’s a hard working, blue collar entrepreneur who is a man of principle and definitely a man of his word!
The media was all over the story and trying to get a piece of Dan, and his email prowess.
The problem was that Mr. Bailey was not saying a word. He was told to keep quiet and he was deathly afraid of losing his home. So naturally, he kept his mouth shut and didn’t speak to anyone about the deal that Mozilo and Countrywide offered him because A. He is a man of his word and B. He just wants to save his home.
2 very good reasons to not answer the phone and your emails.
A week went by and I finally received a call back from Dan.
We spoke about our lives and the crazy email that turned into a media frenzy. He explained to me that he was 100% naive to what was going on and it was all happening so fast. One day he finds my forum and the next he is all over the papers and in the TV. Then to top it off he is getting calls from the office of the president instructing him on what he can and cannot do.
He was confused, and terrified on what he should do. The fear of losing his home and the threat from the Countrywide Freeze Super Hero kept him scared straight and his lips sealed! Talk and lose your home, or keep quiet and keep your home.
Heck, what would any other red blooded American homeowner do? Remain silent, right?!
Well, not so fast……
You see, Dan went on to explain that he wasn’t too happy with what happened to him, and what it has done to his life. What started with just trying to do the right thing and save his home, turned into repeated bashings against his character and his motives.
He was hurt by what people were saying about him. He had spoken to some close friends of his about the fiasco, and then realized that maybe the deal Countrywide gave him was really a bad deal. Maybe he was pressured into signing something he never should have signed.
I then proceeded to ask him of he ever signed a confidentiality agreement and he said,
“No, they never sent one and they explained to him since he was a man of his word, they will not require him to sign it.”
I said, “Oh really? Interesting. Do you mind explaining to me what they offered you Dan? In fact, can you fax it to me?”
He then told me the deal that he signed was set in stone as of that day, and I said, “Oh really? Interesting!”
Yes, it is interesting that Mr. Dan Bailey was given a pretty decent loan modification. But what was VERY interesting was the fact that Dan still can’t afford the loan offered to him by Countrywide.
Yes, he CAN’T afford the terms given to him.
It doesn’t take a seasoned 20 year CEO of the World’s largest lender, to figure out that he can’t make this payment and rate and that he will soon be just another foreclosure statistic. In comparing the loan modification given to him and his monthly income, he is negative with just his mortgage payment.
I guess the Countrywide Freeze Super Hero did not take into affect that a man has to eat, and heat his home to live. I guess they figure Mr. Bailey will just grow his own food, heat his home with lumber he cuts down in the forest, and convert his petrol burning car to vegetable oil, so he can get free gas to and from work from the local hamburger stand. While he’s at it, he can get some left over food to eat because 110% of his income is going to the mortgage and Mozilo????????
So, what does this all mean?
It means that the Countrywide Mozilo Email scandal is not over and Dan is far from living hapily ever after.
He feels that he was literally swindled, and pressured into signing a deal that was made to fail. Mr. Bailey is not happy that his name has been dragged through the mud and that the world’s largest lenders, and one of the world’s highest paid CEO’s, have placed his hard working ass in a worse off position than before.
Is it unfair and deceptive, the way Mozilo and the Countrywide camp has acted? Did they use deceptive techniques to steer him into signing an agreement that was really unfair? Did they place him in another unaffordable loan? Did they violate any other laws in their attempts to hush this homeowner with their homeowner muzzle?
These are all questions that Mr. Bailey and his new lawyer will have to answer for you.
Meanwhile on 6/4/2008 the LoanSafe.org forum was hit by German hackers and spammers that infiltrated our boards with vulgar, hardcore porn and viruses. The peculiar thing about the first attack ever is that the only forums and posts that were attacked were all Countrywide related. The thread where Mr. Bailey found Angelo Mozilo’s email was one of the infected threads.
One has to think if this is just a coincidence or another attempt by the Countrywide Freeze Super Hero trying to damage control and cover up the hideous Countrywide truth.
To be continued……………………………….. 
Media Inquirees to speak with Mr. Dan Bailey, his lawyer, or Moe:
Moe Bedard 951-531-0148 email: moe@loansafe.org
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I am behind you Moe all the way – Mr. Mozillo & CountryWide is what is truly disgusting !!!!!!
still using manipulative tactics and BS language to confuse & control regular folks — that is f***ed up !!! they are corporate giants using their money & power to screw the little guys and keep getting richer… DAMN that is part of the problem in this country….
Mr. Dan Bailey – I feel for you & i believe that some of us are truly going through hardships and struggling to save our homes and families sanity… I too feel like a number and have been dealing back & forth with CountryWide for months…
It is a nightmare for me and my kids, i don’t sleep well at all lately, trying to figure out if i get a 2nd job, when do i see mykids & who will take care of them if i do get a 2nd job, as it is i work 10 hours daily. i have sold furniture and almost anything i have had to save my home and it still isn’t enough !
What do we do with all the money we have invested in our home. With the savings I had for emergencies. the 54K+ is down to zero, zilch, nada … i did not expect to be laid off last year.. 8 – 9 months.
GOOD LUCK TO YOU MR. BAILEY !
I am sure there are a lot of pist off CountryWide borrowers & ex-employees who would be willing to join you in your fight.
I for one am in.
What were the terms of the loan!?
Here we go again!!!!!!!
Moe-
You don’t get it. Here is the reality of the situation.
1. Mr. Bailey signed up for a loan that he should never have taken. It appears he should never have purchased a home.
2. Countrywide granted him credit. Most likely not the best business decision for them.
3. Mr. Bailey did not understand the terms of his loan, and is now unable to pay it back.
4. Countrywide wants their money back.
Please answer this question: “Who is responsible for their mortgage payment, the bank, the taxpayers, or the borrower that signed the note and deed of trust?” All the b.s. in the world does not diminish the fact that Mr. Bailey signed the paperwork, and now he is stuck. Why is this such a difficult concept for people to understand. Who cares that an email was sent out to Mr. Bailey saying this type of behavior is disgusting. Mr. Bedard, if you had lent someone money, and they were unable to pay you back, would you not be the least bit upset about it? Please respond to this email. I am very saddened about the state of personal responsibility in this country. We are on the verge of becoming a socialistic society because of poor choices that were made by consumers during this real estate bubble.
Why do people not get assistance when they are making the largest personal financial decision in their life?
Please reply to this post with a clear concise answer to these questions. Again, the answers to these questions can be found by “looking in the mirror”!
You mean, after borrowing hundreds of thousands of dollars, he’s being asked to pay it back? How unfair!
The terms of the loan modification will be kept confidential until further instructions from Mr. Bailey’s attorney.
The facts that will be let out are that he was palced in a modification that was meant to fail based on simple common sense undweriting.
He is at 110% debt to income ratio just with his mortgage and nothing else. You can’t place someone in a product that is unfair and use deceptive and strong arm techniques to do so.
That is a big no, no.
Can someone say, predatory loan modifications? I think Mr. Mozilo and his Freeze Super Hero can………….
Thanks for your contuinued support Carrie. We need you around here and at http://www.LoanSafe.org. The homeowner haters wil be out in full force here soon with their forked tongues and homeowners hating comments.
All is fair in love and war. This sure isn’t love, so I guess this means war.
A contract is a contract yes, lookinthemirror, BUT, when the contract becomes unfair and deceptive is when that contract can be rescinded and may become a thorn in Countrywides side.
I sugest you read the laws that protect all consumers. Maybe TILA and RESPA. Try your states unfair and deceptive business practices laws and see how that can relate to mortgage contracts and even loan modifications. Maybe even the RICO act will come into paly here also.
Don’t matter what they sign. It is how they are coerced into signing that deterimes if that contract is in fact valid and enforceable.
My gut tells me that many of these loans and modification are in fact unfair and very deceptive. Actually it is more then my gut because I see this happen all the time.
Moe-
You are amazing. “Homeowner Haters’????” The only thing I hate is stupidity. These notes and deeds of trusts are recorded documents signed by the borrower’s themselves. What am I missing here? Once you sign the note, you are obligated to repay it! I think this is all pretty clear. Again, why would you sign something if you are unsure or unclear about the terms. No one is forcing a borrower to sign loan papers. I just don’t get it. Please give me an answer that makes sense.
The simple facts are as follows, nothing more, nothing less:
1. Banks allowed lax underwriting standards which provided easy money to all americans. Big mistake. They should not be protected for making poor decisions. They should be subject to the harsh realities of the business world, and be allowed to fail. As you will notice, the stock prices for these firms has been beaten down to nothing. The market is efficient in the sense that it recognizes the poor risk management at these institutions and is penalizing them now for it.
2. More importantly, the American consumer drank the koolaid. Why in the world would anyone sign documents they don’t understand without getting advice from a 3rd party???
3. Finally, all the people that pay their obligations on time, and didn’t sign up for loans they couldn’t afford are know in the position to have to bail these people out, and the banks that loaned the money as well.
These are the facts, nothing more, nothing less. All the “sad stories” and fluff pieces will do nothing to dispute these facts. The reality of the situation is that American’s have been living above their mean’s for several years’ (including our government), and it is now time to pay the piper. Obama will win the presidency in a landslide, and the only possibility to save this country will be to nationalize banks, and many other industries, and turn the country into a “socialistic state.” Unfortunately, this will turn America into a 3rd world nation. I currently consider us a 2nd world nation. Wake up, and look in the mirror!!!!!!!!!
Lookinthemirror has some heavy tunnel vision here. I agree that many people did sign for loans they thought they could pay back by selling their home for MORE money. But, and here is the sticky part, underwriting guidelines are not suppose to take that into account. The lenders all knew this, yet waved off the dangers in hopes of being speculators themselves.
The first line of defense in this system of borrowing and lending is the person asking the questions of the borrower, period. Yes, a borrower can lie about their income, but a good loan officer is, in most states by law, suppose to require the borrower provide PROOF OF INCOME. Any loan programs designed or abused to get around that simple point are not the fault of the borrower, but of the lender and its underwriters. They are the gatekeepers of the money. If the gatekeepers fail, how can you blame the borrower, especially when the loan officer, who is assumed to have the credentials and moral character to protect the lender, is only concerned about his/her commission, regardless of ability to pay a loan back.
Lookinthemirror sounds like someone who may subconciously feel some responsibility. Maybe they are/were a LO or AE or Underwriter?
Mark my words, there will be many individual brokers and AEs as well as underwriters that will be dragged into court over this very issue. Some will face jail time. I will operate under the impression that sentiments expressed by those like lookinthemirror are futile attempts to deflect guilt, shame, liabilty or a combination of all the above.
Keep it up Moe. The voice of the victims needs to be presented.
Moe,
You are a grandstanding Douchebag.
The fact is this poor guy can’t continue on living in his house if he can’t afford it. It’s doubtful he *ever* could truthfully afford this house.
If you drop the rate to 0% he’ll still be in an unaffordable situation. This guy just needs to sell and move on.
Unfortunately he’s got you leading him around pushing your agenda and trying to make yourself “relevant”.
Again – You are a Grandstanding Douchebag!
I have to say i’m on the side of those who don’t feel bad for this guy. I did before, but if they put together a modification, and he STILL can’t afford it, then obviously this guy put himself in WAY over his head from the beginning. not saying c-wide scum did no wrong here, but clearly this guy was in a loan he shouldn’t have been in and a house he could never have afforded.
Moe-
It sounds to me as if there was no potential modification that would have worked. If he is at 110% debt ratio with the new program-that means the payment would need to be less than half of the new one to make it affordable. There is no financial institution that would set this sort of precedence, the writedown on this sort of transaction would cause financial ruin if multiplied by all the modifications needed.
The reality of this situation-he couldn’t afford the home, he’s signed 2 notes that he can’t afford, so he should sell and buy something he can afford. The bank deserves it’s money back, as do the investors(more than just Countrywide is involved in this security), and they deserve more than 40 cents on the dollar based on your comments.
There are solutions, and they can’t be all borrower weighted. At least be open in your comments, and offer solutions.
Rates are higher than they were a few years ago. Countrywide cannot jump into their flying Delorean and give Mr. Bailey a low teaser rate he probably got years ago….
I agree 100% with “Lookinthemirror”. This the problem in this country today. Guys like Mr. Bailey should never have owned a home in the first place. Somehow it becomes the lenders problem that Mr. Bailey is too inept at reading and comprehending mortgage docs and because of this they should give him a free loan? People, are you serious?? I’m sure some of us here pay our bills and take responsibility for our own lives. How is it fair that someone, due to their own lack of judgement gets a free ride?
No one has “modified” my loan when I have a bad month so that I can pay my mortgage more easily. I have to figure it out on my own. Personally, I think the lion share of these threads are self serving weak attempts at somehow justifying why these LO’s are not good at this business. Mr. Bailey, at least on the surface, looks like someone who needs to rent an apartment until he can figure out what it means to truly own a home. Until then, get a different job, make more money or get out. You’re not doing Cwide any favors by being late every month.
As for “Moe”, get real man. My guess is that Tony Soprano wasn’t there to “coerce” Mr. Bailey into signing anything. He had the oppurtunity to shop the GFE, to recind, to demand a lower rate, or simply not sign. These are choices. Bad choices lead to bad results and good choices..well, you know. That’s what it means to live in a free country.
Don’t get caught up in the hype. We all had a hand in this mess, including and in my opinion especially the American public. We are a nation of underachieving self gratifiers with little concept of hard work and responsiblity. In Russia you can’t even own a home, imagine what they think about this.
As for Mozillo? He was probably right. The media probably coached some of these people in terms how to respond and what to say. It would’nt suprise me at all. Mr. Mozillo is a business man, pure and simple. He’s not saving the manatees guys. Most of you would have bailed and moved to Costa Rica if you were in his shoes and had his kind of money. It’s time to wake up and quit make excuses for bad choices!
Something some people may be missing is that there could have been life events/changes that may have caused some of these issues. I wish there was some way to determine what percentage of these foreclosures/defaults are as a result of rates adjusting, etc. and which are a result of life changing events (loss of income, job, etc.). Or what percentage are people just walking away because of the domino effect of foreclosures in the surrounding area causing their own homes to drop in value so severely that negative equity is created. I just think there’s blame to go around everywhere, and people shouldn’t just blame the lender for a situation they also got themselves into also.
I have been following this thread for awhile and I am wondering when people are going to realize that these people should have never been given a loan in the first place. Sounds like he was way over his head to began with. I also am a believer that if he was willing to sign his name on the dotted line with out a gun to his head then he should man up and pay his bills or sell. I am tired of reading articles and post from people bashing mortgage shops for borrowers dumb mistakes. I don’t know about you or anybody else on here, but if I am going to make the biggest purchase in my life then I am goin got know the terms. Maybe uneducated people shouldn’t buy homes because that’s essentially what I see here and in many other cases, or the buyers are just playing stupid!!!
To gofuckyourselfmoe! Why don’t you take a bit of your own RX? I always love people who call names and make attacks behind a veil of secrecy! Why don’t you be a man and man up to who you are and ID yourself? Or, are you a gutless coward or a PR hack trying to defame Moe who is doing good work? I think you’re most likely a bit of both! What are you contributing to life or this crisis except your ill will, darkness, BS, stupidity, arrogance, ignorance, and asinine remarks? Do us all a favor, identify yourself or take a flying F**king leap off the nearest bridge and take your buddies and Maz along for the ride of the end of your lives! The world would be a better place without the cons, crooks, and losers!
To gofuckyourselfmoe! Why don’t you take a bit of your own RX? I always love people who call names and make attacks behind a veil of secrecy! Why don’t you be a man and man up to who you are and ID yourself? Or, are you a gutless coward or a PR hack trying to defame Moe who is doing good work? I think you’re most likely a bit of both! What are you contributing to life or this crisis except your ill will, darkness, BS, stupidity, arrogance, ignorance, and asinine remarks? Do us all a favor, identify yourself or take a flying F**king leap off the nearest bridge and take your buddies and Maz along for the ride of the end of your lives! The world would be a better place without the cons, crooks, and losers!
Dna “bought” his home in 1993 for $41,000 and refinanced in 2006 for God knows how much. Why is it Countrywide’s fault that he signed for a loan he cannot afford? And – if he cannot afford the modification, then he needs to foreclose on the house. Where is all the cash from his refinance?
Agree. To make an informed opinion as to who is being treated unfairly we need to know the facts: What were the terms of the original loan? Did Mr. Baily honestly qualify for it or was it a liars loan? Was he duped in the beginning? What were the terms of the modification? Has Mr. Baily simply fallen on hard times or could he ever afford this house?
While I am no fan of Mozilo and was amused my his response, one must keep in mind that CW, and other lenders, is faced with hordes of morally, but not financially, bankrupt borrowers trying to wiggle out of their commitments.
If you have been following his story, Mr. Bailey bought his home many years ago and was able to afford it.
Life changing / hardship caused him to take ouit a 2nd loan and is now in a bad situation. all Mr. Bailey do was ask for help.
There are a lot of people to blame…. but it doesn’t change the fact that the greedy banks created these loan products, the greedy brokers/loan officers did creative financing to get people into these loans & products.
so LOOK IN THE MIRROR when you ask in question # 2 “More importantly, the American consumer drank the koolaid. Why in the world would anyone sign documents they don’t understand without getting advice from a 3rd party???” it is simple a lot & I mean MANY people did ask advice of their ‘professional’ broker/ loan officer and got BullS**t answers or the run around for them to sign.
I graduated from college and when i closed on my first house I coiuld barely understand the 100’s of pages in those closing documents and when I did ask the broker or title person or even the bank rep, I took what they said as true & fact since they were the professional in their industry. I KNOW BETTER NOW !
most brokers don’t know s**t and the banks use them as the fall out .. CountryWide is one of the most fraudulent companies I can think of.
Mikey, Frank & Look in the Mirror: lets say for shits & giggles, that you were to lose your job, your income producing spouse, you became terminally ill, one of your kids did — you go through your savings not to lose the house you have raised your family in.. & with todays economy can not find a well paying job, can not keep up with the price of gas & food, What do you do?? walk away??? NO, you stand up and fight for what you have invested in…. You reach out for help !!!!!
isn’t that what your parents taught you, what you teach your kids, that when you are in trouble (whatever kind of trouble) you go & talk to your family, your friends whomever might be able to help you… You do however learn from your mistakes. well hopefully.
Why do you buy car insurance? in case of an accident
why do you buy home-owners? in case of a hurricane or fire or theft
why do you have health insurance? incase of illness
if you have a wound and leave it untreated it festers and could eventually cause death …. This is what is happening This industry is wounded if you don’t stop the bleeding with some type of solutions it is going to get really really bad !
I agree to some extent with some of you that there are brokers and bankers who are honest (very few), there are also borrowers who deserve to be foreclosed on because of greed in buying properties to flip or poor investment choices, but not all of the borrowers are there.
Everyone is to blame to some extent, but i keep saying it over & over – we need solutions somehow, someway …
Instead of you all attacking Moe for allowing all of us to learn from each other and here each others opinion in an open forum, we should use that same energy to help others. PAY IT FORWARD !
Be kind to your neighbors, Enjoy your family, love your kids, plan for the future and learn from yours & others mistakes…
Courtesy can be contagious , and any acts of kindness no matter how small will never go unnoticed !!!
Voice your opinion and stop the hate, & remember everytime you point a finger you have 3 of your own pointing back at you!
MOE,, YOU ROCK !!!!!
Nye Lavalle – why don’t you ask Moe to “man up” on who he is and ID himself. Do you know what his background is? Do you know how he currently makes his living? Guys who profess “many years” experience in the mortgage industry don’t just pop up from no where. Let’s have Moe explain to us exactly where and how he got all that experience and most especially what he’s doing now. Come on – let’s have some full disclosure!
Attention Lookinthemirror and gofuckyourselfmoe! You two are hilarious! I can only imagine why you are so adamantly opposed to Moe providing a real life story about Countrywide’s dirty business dealings. This is a classic case of shooting the messenger. Both of you can say that Dan shouldn’t have gotten a home loan till you’re blue in the face, but the fact remains that Countrywide sold him a loan, not once, but twice!
When Countrywide changed its business practices and sold home loans to very, risky borrowers, the company itself accepted more risk. In turn, it made a lot of profits in the past few years. You two seem really butt hurt that it’s gamble didn’t work out. Now, Dan will most likely lose his home and tank his credit (that was the risk he took). But Countrywide and other slimly lenders are going to be on the hook for all the investor’s money they swindled and didn’t pay back. Hopefully, there is lots of jail time involved!
Moe – you better hope Mr. Bailey and his past will stand up to media scrutiny!
Nye, why dont you quit your bitching. It is not CW’s fault it took Mr. Bailey this long to figure out he should be renting an apartment…
To: All those who don’t get it
RE: Previous Posts
Please read in detail my posts, and explain to me where I am wrong? You keep going back to your arguments that the banks “sold” these people bad loans. The protection against that is an informed consumer, and intelligent decision making. If there is a “seller”, there must be a buyer. I am tired of hearing these ridiculous stories about “personal” hardship. Granted, there are times when people have situations that occur beyond their control. So, what is the next step in the process: SELL YOUR HOUSE IMMEDIATELY. Owning a home is not a “right” in the United States, it is a privilege.
I have yet to here any coherent post that will dissuade me from the facts: 1) Borrower’s signed their notes and deeds of trusts that are recorded documents. If they were unable to “understand” the hundred’s of pages of documents, than maybe they should not have signed them??? 2) Banks that made risky loans are being penalized by the marketplace by either being shut down, or having their stock prices drop to a point where they may not recover. This is what happens to all business’ (and individuals) when they make unsound decisions. The term for this is “creative destruction”, and it is one of the basis of our capitalistic society. Remember a company called Pets.com….they are no longer in business for a reason.
Again, I would like to hear a coherent, sensible counter argument to the facts I have presented?
Dear ProudHomeowner:
are you perfect?????
everyone has their past, but because of it does it allow a Giant like Mozillo & CountryWide to trample on him?????
I am proud of Mr. Bailey for being a recovered Alcoholic, he got his stuff together has been sober and bought his home years ago… Life dealt him a another set of circumstances & yes he may have made an error in signing those other documents on his 2nd loan, but sometimes in desperate times, you don’t think correctly. Ok ?
Maybe he can not afford his loan mod & will have to lose his home, but it does not change the fact that CountryWide used the investors money to fund both his loans, and approved him for the $ on the loan , and it doesn’t change the fact that Mozillo sent an email that was distasteful about Mr. Baileys hardship letter. how many emails with worse comments has Mozillo and his crew shared but didn’t leak to us??? MANYYYYYY
CountryWide has been processing and closing bad deals for the last few years, how do you think Mozillo became such a wealthy man and moved CountryWide bank so far up the ladder, but was goes up quickly will come crashing down !!!!! How do those investors deal with all his bad purchases, will all the bad loans? they lose too, I am sure the investor would rather lower the rate and get paid their money back than to have another foreclosed home sitting in the courts with no clear sight of it selling for years…. will the investors go after Mozillo too?
I hope Mr. Bailey can learn & recover from this experience and move on…. & as I said earlier lets try to take care of one another, it seems lately everyone is out for themselves and I don’t want to raise my children like that. I believe kindness can go a long way…
what if in 2006 he took out 100k to pay off credit cards with a stated pick a pay loan. the CWIDE rep told him it was a 2% fixed for 30 yrs? sure he signed the contract… too bad we are not a lawyer state.
Just trying to play devil advocate for those who are hating on dan and moe, we have no idea what situation he is in and everyone is just haten. maybe he never even got gfe work, just a loan docs in front of him and hi pressured sales.
look in the mirror you seem to only have tunnel vision….
think outside the box ! don’t be so narrow minded & one sided.
Where you allowed to draw outside of the lines?
Play outside & get dirty?
I just don’t think you are open minded enough about the current state of this country.. The situation is pretty bad and it is going to get worse, I don’t think it will get any better by having more people homeless, and losing what so many have worked so hard to obtain….
Look in the mirror you fail to see that in your world the banks & brokers are wonderful. but come to the Real World most of them are not, they have manipulated a system the gov’t has allowed to go way out of control the last 4 years, the banks (especially CW & Angelo Mozillo) have taken advantage and manipulated the system as well. the states do almost nothing to get brokers trained properly much less have ethics when explaining a contract or binding documents, WHY? because realors, brokers, banks are greedy they are only thinking sign, sign, sign as soon as this borrower signs i have my commission check.. they think lets just tell them enough or what they need to hear to sign.. some borrowers i know tried to get out of not signing their loans and were manipulated and threatened that their deposit will be lost, their credit shattered a bunch of bogus shit to get them to sign. I even know brokers who doubled the huds / closing docs {meaning they would show the borrower one set have them sign , then forgue their signatures on the true set} the one they signed did not show YSP or the arm adj or the prepay, but that is what they got. So then Look In The Mirror who is responsible for that? the borrower who trusted their broker and bank???? NOT wake up !
Why doesn’t anyone ever get to the point. Mr. Bailey know his income and his take home pay. Mr. Bailey know his mortgage payment, taxes and insurance. The simple fact is how did Mr. Bailey expect to make his mortgage payments among his other monthly responsibilities.
I have a mortgage, I pay my bills and my other monthly obligations and put money away for my children’s college. I am not a top exective, but I do live within my means. I didn’t udnerstand the terms and conditions of my mortgage, so i asked my attorney and he explained everything to me, hence I haev a normal straight 30 Yr Fixed Rate and living life like I should.
Except for the fact that the greedy borrower’s (who wanted to live above their means) loan officers, lender’s, rating agencies, wall street firms, etc have cause such a unstabile market that I, the taxpayer, is going to bare the brunt of all of this.
So why is it not fair to Mr. Bailey to lose his home, why isn;t it fair for Countrywide to take a loss, why isn’t it fair, please explain.
Moe and everyone esle on Mr. Bailey’s side, are you paying your bills and surviving?
Mr. Bailey is not only irresponsible for not living within his means but is irresponsible for not seeking help in an error that he did nto have expertise. I do not see Mr. Bailey drilling his own teeth, prescribing his own medicine.
Eeryone party involed should fess up and rectify this and this blogs prefessing to be a proponent of the borrower is not helping the situation. Yu are glorying this to get yoru 15 minutes of fame.
Thank you and God Bless whatever will be left of this country.
Rick-
This is a direct response to your “gate keeper” post. If you look in the paper you will see that hundred’s of bank stocks are hammered, or they have merged or been shut down. This shows that the “gate-keepers” (Corporations that made poor decisions) are being penalized by their shareholders. You made mention that it is a loan officer’s job to collect “income verification” from a client. If the program as dictated by the bank, did not require income documentation, than why would they ask for it? If you are living in “present” day America, you would notice that most banks have gone back to traditional underwriting guidelines because of their poor risk management over the past several years’ which created the losses that they are seeing.
The borrower issue is a completely different one. If they did not feel comfortable with the terms of their loans, there are several remedies: 1) Don’t sign on the dotted line 2) Get a 2nd Opinion 3) Go to another lender/broker for a different type of loan. The reason that all of this is a problem right now is that home prices are on the decline (and will continue to do so) and now people are crying “foul”. You didn’t hear anyone complaining about their loan programs 2 years’ ago when the market was booming. Ignorance may be bliss in the short run, but not in the long run. You need to wake up, and quit blaming those who may have been enablers, and focus where the real problem lies: people purchased homes that they shouldn’t have, and did not manage their future risk responsibly. Now the tax payers will have to bail out these people for their ignorance.
The great thing about this country is that we have free will (and outlets) to publish our feelings, thoughts and biases on any topic including religion, politics and/or the news that surrounds and impacts us.
Americans love money. We love wealth, luxury and success, it is what made our country what it is. Certainly everyone on this forums passion comes thru and in many cases there are good arguments for reasons and blame, just as there were forums for why you should be a real estate investor and prior to that a technology investor and prior to that a ……
This thing should be over in 12 months and hopefully all you idiots who thought you needed to drive a BMW and text on your Blackberry will disappear and we will get back to working for a living.
I am personally tired of the victim mentality. Quit your bitching (and spending time on this blog) and go get a 2nd job, lazy fuck. Your dad would be embarrassed.
Jessi-
Again, you completely miss the point of my posts. You are talking about illegality in the form of “forging” documents. That is a crime that will eventually catch up to the perpetrator. Somehow, you want to mix this in with a buyer’s signing recorded documents, and then crying “foul” that they didn’t understand the terms. Forgery and ignorance are two different things. Look in the mirror, that is where most answers to problems can be found!!!!!
Kempers
I think you have the right idea of how things have been working with CountryWide.
Moe
keep up the GREAT work and this forum, i don’t get tired of telling you enough. You have a thick skin to deal with some of the BS comments etc, but I respect you for handling yourself as a professional and adult. you are open minded enough to allow EVERYONE to express their feeling their thoughts even if they don’t agree with you. YOU GO MOE !!!!
I will help you and others Pay It Foward any & every time I can.
You have taught me that there are still people in this world with balls and a heart. & that it is ok to be human !
LoanSafe.org & Loanworkout.org has been a blessing for me & my family. I feel i have some sanity left to know that I am not alone to understand what i have done wrong with my home purchase and mortgage loan… YOU KICK ASSSSSSSSSS
I will no longer take the word of a ‘professional’as fact, because it is ok to question them, eventhough most of our lives we are taught to listen to the teacher, the manager, the boss,
But we are all learning they are not always right. (sad it has taken me 38 years to figure that out).
Look for instance at our current gov’t this country is in a serious mess…… question the president, question your gov’t, question the execs, CEO etc of the banks…
you have every right to fight for your home and every right not to want to get screwed !!!!!
dear CONFUSED you start your post by stating:
“Why doesn’t anyone ever get to the point. Mr. Bailey know his income and his take home pay. Mr. Bailey know his mortgage payment, taxes and insurance. The simple fact is how did Mr. Bailey expect to make his mortgage payments among his other monthly responsibilities.”
——-
Well shouldn’t CountryWide have known that when they took the loan application for the 2nd loan?
checked his income, bank statements, etc
Why then did they lend Mr. Bailey the money?????
How did CountryWide expect MR. Bailey to pay back the money if he did not qualify?
Mr. Bailey stated on a different post in this forum that an unexpected illness and certain circumstances had him fall behind and unable to pay back the loan now. All Mr. Bailey was doing was asking the loan modification for help to continue to pay back his debt with a reasonable payment and program. So do you & look in the mirror think it would have been bettter for him to walk away from his obligations and live mtg free for 10 – 12 months while they foreclose on his home?
No Mr. Bailey was trying to man up to his responsiblities and try to get help, if the answer would have been no, then he would have tried to figure something else out.
But Mozillo replied to his email istead of hitting forward.
Mr. Bailey is doing or is trying to do what anyone would try to do to save their home, anything…. some of us have to work 2 jobs, some have to live in a box to feed our children, whatever the case may be, do not fault Mr. Bailey for trying….
atleast he didn’t give up and walk away…..
no matter what the outcome I wish everyone nothing but health and strength during this difficult financial times.
Carrie-
38 years to figure it out, so you started owning a house when you were say, 25, that puts you at 63 years old.
So between your Enron stock purchase debacle and your constant withdrawals from your savings account (i.e. home equity) you are feeling a pinch as you ease into the golden years.
Get your shinebox.
Kempers-
It appears that you have learned a lesson in life. Unfortunately, it took you so long. Whenever, you make a big decision in life like getting married, buying a home, investing in the stock market, voting for a president, there are responsibilities and consequences for these choices.
I am very glad to hear that you have come to grips with this, and are now on the right track. Job well done….hopefully, this will be a learning experience for all those people who didn’t budget correctly in the past, and our now feeling the pain. You have taken the time to look in the mirror, and realize that you didn’t like what you saw, and now are trying to take corrective action. Congratulations.
Look in the mirror,
what I was trying to say is that besides all the forgery going on, the BS, some good people were trusting of their brokers and got the short end of the stick…
so now that the smoke in the mirrors has cleared, these borrowers are completely confused and can not afford their mortgages. I am sure they have looked in the mirror and feel foolish for believing and trusting the professionals to have their best interest at heart and felt awful when they realized they were used for a huge commission check and another # on the pipeline monthly closed file log.
So Look in the mirror when you are sick do you not go to the Dr to find out what is wrong? Do you not take his word of a professional? It would probably piss you off if your Dr told you that the small lump you felt was nothing to later find it has grown into a Cancer. I am just saying… some of these people/borrowers did not understand their contracts and did ask for help in understanding and were given BS answers by the professional and are now paying the price. Some of these brokers/bankers/loan officers could have offered them a better deal for them and their family but chose the product or program that was paying them more. the gov;t & the banks & the greedy brokers are all to blame…. it is not the borrowers fault they provided 100% loans, SISA & NO Doc programs. in the old days you didn’t have 20% down you just didn’t buy a house. Granted back then the average home was $60,000 (20% down is $12,000) now a days the average home is $450,000 (20% down is 90,000) what average working american in todays age can honestly put away that much money? & the price of gas, the price of a gallon on milk? Do you think the gov’t should raise the minimum wage as fast as the cost of living? I think that would be fair.
Take off the visors so you stop having tunnel vision and open you sight and mind to other options….
Jessi-
You make a “great point” with your cancer analogy. If I was diagnosed with cancer, I would go and get a 2nd and 3rd opinion. At that point, I would go on the web to analyze what choices I thought were the best for my situation. Then I would consult with family and friends and come up with what I consider to be the best course of action based on reviewing all my resources. Your point goes directly to the heart of the matter. Most people were either ignorant, or just plain stupid to buy a home they could not afford. To blame the enablers is just not facing the facts. I don’t understand why people can not differentiate this obvious reality. I have yet to here one coherent post that counters what I have been stating?? I have never “blogged” before, however, this is such an important issue, that I feel like I have to comment on this situation. We are a nation of people that have been successful due to our self-reliance. Now, we have become a nation that blames others for their situation, and is not capable of taking responsibility for our mistakes. This is a tipping point for our country. I can only hope that whoever is the next president takes ownership for our problems, and sets forth policies that will turn things around. Otherwise, we will be in a similar economic situation that Argentina faced in 2001. I would recommend that anyone facing financial hardship read the book “Rich Dad, Poor Dad.”
What part of “this is how much you will have to pay each month” do you think Mr. Baily or all the other people who can’t make their payments didnt understand? Loan and closing documents can be very confusing but it all comes down to if you borrow this much, you will have to pay this much each month. If you can’t figure that out, with or without a college education, you shouldn’t be signing the papers.
stupidisasstupiddoes:
WEll WEll aren’t you just the chipper one !!!
what i am saying is that it is sad that I am 38 years old and figuring out how Nasty some people can be.
I was brought up that what mom & dad say was right, when I went to school i trusted the teachers to be of knowledge, when i get sick i trust my Dr’s diagnosis, when i bought my first property in 1996 i trusted the mortgage professionals.
What I am trying to tell you that i try to see the good in everyone and I trusted my professional so when I finally sold my condo and purchased my home I trusted the bank and the broker. and now when i look back at my paperwork and got another unbiased pro to look at it they had put a 5 year prepay i knew nothing about, they made 3 points in the YSP, they charged me 1 point discount 1 point origination because I was told I was buying my fixed rate. as low as possible to later find out that the YSP was additional money they made for selling a much higher rate…. That is why i am angry, i have learned from that mistake and i thank this blog & the forum for the new knowledge i have acquired. Knowledge is power and you learn something new everyday if you let yourself. Unless of course you and look in the mirror now it all….
& NO i did not use a Heloc as my savings.
I have a Savings account which i had over 54k at this time last year for emergencies and savings and did not forsee that i was going to be laid off after 7 years of working for a company and had to deplete my savings to meet my financial obligations during my 9month unemployment. I am currently working making 3/4 if that of what i use to earn and trying to budget accordingly.
& NO I don’t drive fancy cars, or live lavishly.
I have always lived within my means, I just happened to have fallen on bad times at a really wrong time.
So are you going to bash me for trying to live an honest life?
for being smart enough to have saved money for times like this?
for having hope in people?
for believing that doing the right thing is always better?
I did not for one second believe it was going to get this bad nor did many others.
So Will you criticize me too for trying to reach CountryWide for help?
Greed is ugly !!!! we all need money to pay our bills and survive but i just don’t think it should be at the expense of another. ‘raping’ a borrower to pay for your mcmillion dollar house mtg and benz & 2 hour lunches at Houstons in the Gables. so do you honestly think Angelo Mozillo is ok for doing what he has done and is doing? NO WAY !!!!!! F**k him and his greedy tan self. he dug his grave now he can lie in it…. why did he use investors money to purchase bad loans? GREED !
I am in the Title and Escrow industry and agree to a lot of what everyone is saying, in that if you do not understand the terms you should not sign. However, not everyone did not understand. Who could have forseen the major drop in prices of homes, gas prices going as high as they are and losing your job after 10 years or more with the same company..Circumstances beyond control is what caused the owner occupied homes to be foreclosed. should we forget the large number of NON-OWNER OCCUPIED properties in foreclosure that really started it. I can’t tell you how may greedy investors signed up for the Option Arm loans and guess what, prices fell, rates rose and they can’t get enough rent to cover the mortgage, so let’s just let them go.
The fact of the matter is that Mr. Bailey is not asking Countrywide to relieve him of his obligation, but instead to help him lower the costs and maintain the payment. It is more expensive to own REO property than it is to just work with Borrower. I work with lenders all day who would rather take a home in foreclosure than to settle for a short sale or work with the homeowner. Pitty we are such a society that is willing to farm out our own jobs to other countries than to help it’s own keep their houses and jobs.
Look in the mirror :
did you understand my cancer analogy ????
if your doctor told you it was nothing & you trust him that is all you need
that is what some of us & I think Mr. Bailey thought when we were informed of our loan docs.
so when he found out he was lied to & the payment doubled he was pist and called the bank for answers.
that is why i said you would probably be mad if you later found out that the lump was actually cancer and now you are reaching out to others to find a solution (another doctor, a forum on the web, friends, family) that is all Mr. Bailey is doing – trying to find a solution to his Cancer ( the option arm)
Escrow officer the last paragraph is part of the reality and problem we are all facing
I would like to know what he signed initially and why he agreed to it ;if he couldn’t afford it
Dear Dave in SanDiego:
you are absolutely right, except you forget one thing.
when the broker is telling the borrower your monthly payment is this much and you see it on paper you believe that as fact, afterall the broker ‘professional’ is telling you this.
so when the broker does not explain the negative amortization to the borrower or explain exactly how these option arms work – is that the borrowers fault.
the borrower asked the question, what is my monthly payment going to be . he was told $ _— a month. the borrower knew that he could afford it for the next 3 – 5 years and the broker then told him “don’t worry you can lower your payment in a few years when you refi into a fixed loans, we do them all the time in our office and I’ll be able to help you then (meaning screw you once more).”
The borrower trusted his broker. Now the economic times are horrible. the home values have depreciated so fast it is out of control… do you think the property tax appraisers office will then also lower the taxes since the value is down? NOT they are greedy to and keep making $.
Don’t you think that salaries should have increased as fast as the cost of living?
or should the richer keep getting richer and forget the rest of the people?
I for one did not understand half of the documents in my closing, I asked the title company to explain them, they barely could read some of the disclosure wording, the broker gave brief explanations at what sounded at the time to be reasonable answers to most of them, skimmed through the hud like a dear caught in headlights. (i know now because of all the POC charges & YSP etc that they didn’t want to disclose)
but now i know that they do not know shit from apple butter.
all they wanted was the loan to fund, for me to sign and get their commission check. When i asked why my application (1003) had been redone, i was told because it didn’t need certain information that was provided on the original I signed to fit the loan? WHAT ???? i now know they used whatever creative financing techniques they needed to get the loan funded. you could here the girls in the office talk about so& so bank has easier conditions to clear,etc etc, they manipulated the system for their benefit, not the borrowers. (Except for the very few good brokers who truly work ethically and with borrowers best interest at heart) for the other 90% crooked greedy ones, i wonder what will happen to you? Karma !!!!!
Jessi-
Your analogy and reasoning is unsound for the following reasons:
You are stating that a doctor did not find a cancer during a screening or check up. Generally, that means that it did not appear on the tests that he ordered. If it was a routine check up, and he didn’t find anything, than what can you do? That is what is called fate. If he ordered additional tests, and they turned up negative, I would think it would be a good idea to reach out for a 2nd opinion. Your analogy to trusting the “professional” is faulty because if something doesn’t “feel” right, then maybe you should get a 2nd opinion. That is what most responsible people do. Mr. Bailey did an irresponsible thing by a) taking on more debt than he should have b) not reaching out for a 2nd opinion. Unfortunately, this is an expensive lessen to learn. Banks have learned it in their stock prices, and buyers/borrower’s have learned it by not being able to afford payments on the mortgages they signed up for. Please explain where I am wrong…..I do not understand your reasoning. If you still own your home, sell it now, and take the loss. Rent a home like you should have done in the first place. The fact that you are hoping the government or banks are going to “bail” you out is a waste of time and money. You have learned a hard lesson in life: Trust, but verify! Good luck to you.
i dontknow how to start from here i dont speak good english i have a loan from countrywide too and my loan for them is $448,000 interest only and its going to change every 6 months ’cause they base it from LIBOR INDEX my loan was used to be from BANCORP ALLIANCE and they sold our loan from CW i told them in my income for $2,000 i cant i afford the loan if its going up more i pay monthly mortgage for $2,193.33 and in the loan i’m the only one there no co borroqwers and the only one i ask them for help ’cause i’m struggling to may every month not to mention food, utility bills den homeowners insurance and the yearly property tax almost $ 7,000 in my county now the hopuse has no value or keep falling and i pay interest only nothing goes to principal i ask them or write them my hadship latter since last year around sept. 2007 and i waited for 2 months ’cause they have to review it all i’m asking if they could help me fixed or pout my momthly payment into affordable so i wont be in delenquent or defualt but they dont ever bother helping me i did again in feburary 2008 ’cause i wasnt qualified for modification they told me submit again all information from W2,bank statement & pay stub i waited again for 2 months nothing happen den i did again last month they ask me again for all the my information then i have to wait another 2 months i’m already behind 1 month now this month will be the second month if they dont help me maybe they just want me to be foreclose my home i dont have no vchoice and let it go i’ve been paying them since 2006 i managew to pay on time it just that its to much in my income alone i will be having hard time to pay it now i’ll be almost 2 months behind all i’m asking for them is to modify myt loan into fixed affordable monthly payment so i could pay them, on time and my family will willing to help but it doesnt make sense for them if my loan is interest only nohting move or happen since 2006 my loan is $448,000 til now $448,00 nothing goes to principal. so to peaople in my situation if they wont bother to help us my would botther wasting your money into nothing when you know they are not going to help you the son of the buthcer anyway mr. mozilo call us anyways disgusting. so right now i submit my t3rd harship letter and i dont expect from them if they going to help me if they going to foreclose my home so be it if they ask me to do short sale i wont make it easy for them to i rather walk away 7 to 10 years in my record i could live with that.
Carrie-
You blame all the enablers, however, you don’t take any responsibility for agreeing to the terms and signing a note and deed of trust that is a recorded document. Why do you think banks require borrower’s to sign these agreements and have them recorded? They do it so people like you don’t cry foul down the road. All they have to do is pull out the recorded document, show you a copy of the note (which explains EXACTLY what the loan terms are), and ask you why did you sign it in front of a notary if you did not understand it?
All of the other information you are giving is pure fluff. They screwed me over, and made big bucks, etc., etc…..I have a piece of the Brooklyn Bridge for sale, maybe I should call you. Look in the mirror!
To Carrie,
all your reasoning makes sense except one. The guy signed the papers borrowing $xxx,xxx.xx. Negative amortization loans are still tracking at the minimum payments that have been detailed for the first 5 years. Yeah, the loan balance grew but if someone is in foreclosure, its because they didn’t make the payments. Even making the minimum payment each month would not cause the loan to hit the reamortiztion phase yet. In fact, the index + margin on most neg am loans is still only about 7.5%. But thats the tracking interest rate, they are still making their minimum monthly payment. the same payment detailed on their loan docs that they said they could afford.
did a loan officer tell them they could refinance them later at a lower rate? Possibly. Did they put that in writing in the loan docs? Probably (absolutely) not.
Granted, their loan may now be worth more than their house and they can’t sell it but unless they were speculators, they weren’t planning to sell the house after 3 years anyway were they?
What it comes down to is it is time people are held responsible for their own actions. You can blame the banks, the brokers, the greedly loan officers or even Countrywide but at the end of the day, the people agreed they understood the docs and signed them.
Before you do your short sale you might want to review the tax laws. If you owe $448K and short sell at $350K, you will get a 1099 at the end of the year for the $98K difference (debt forgiveness). You’ll owe the taxes on this. Better plan for a bankruptcy.
When you signed the documents that said the payments would go up, didnt you plan ahead for that possibility? Or did you think that interest rates at 40 years lows would go even lower?
to those people in here who are pro wall street or have sympathy with the banks,lenders,brokers,appraisser and real estate agent you guys dont know shit you guys are not the one who wake up at night thinking when the next monthly payment are going to come where i’m i going to get that money to pay for it. i work hard i pay tax too. it just happen those broker take advantage of me cause i dont speak good english if i know the in and out only i will walk away but those greedy brokers are train to do that how to get those buyers they ewill do antything in there power just to get you tell you everything is going to be find some buyers could be qualified for priome rate or fixed loan instead of those toxic loan or ARM because of that YSP they could get more commision so they dont have skin if they put you in the bad loan that you cannot afford that how may broker did it to me will state your income so you could qualify to this loan and after a year you could refinance your loan now i’m stock that’s how good those broekr or loan officer even whop speak good english or born here in amrica get fooled thae one they could take advantage more those who dont speak good or understand good in english they thinking making them beliieve getting or owning a house is simple as that and now they fucxked up the small people and its destry family.
Look in the mirror
there was never a notary present when i signed any of the closing docs for one
secondly, i understand why these mega billion dollar companies with billion dollar attorneys have you sign docs in which you can’t even pronounce or understand the words it is to Cover Their Ass. But why don’t they have the closings filmed or recorded when their bank rep is lieing about the documents you are signing? What about the part when they provide you a GFE the day of closing to bring the cashiers check and it is nothing at all to the figures you were told in the beginning..
Why because the know the realtors, sellers, etc have a contract which has a date when it will expire, they also know you have x $$$ in escrow you could lose if you don’t close by such and such a date — do you see the pattern here. the borrower was getting screwed by a whole bunch of people, ( the bank, the broker, the title company, the realtor, the inflated appraisals etc etc etc) I just want you to acknowledge that there are many people to blame, not just the borrower for not understanding a document. these borrowers have been lied to and manipulated on many levels. by the time you do close you are exhausted…
it is what it is & look in the mirror you seem to only have one opinion and unwilling to understand that some borrowers trusted those professionals and were misguided..
Dave in San Diego
if the people truly understood what they were signing we would not be in this mess.
Everyone talks about him not being able to afford his modification. I agree and disagree with many of you on all of these various facts. Many of you all have ver very valid points.
The point is, has anyone bothered to even verify whether or not he truly can afford the loan? Probably not. Does his wife work? Does he have extended family living with him that work? Maybe illegal alien relatives that live with him and work for cash? Maybe he has side “cash” jobs? Did he have disability income coming in for a while? Maybe L&I income? Food Stamps? EX-Girlfriend who was a co-borrower that broker up with him? Mabe he gambled his money away? Maybe he got demoted on his job? Maybe he had a trust fund, and had income from that and blew it all? Maybe he played the stocks and lost his shorts? Maybe he got divorced? Maybe a child died? Maybe the LO fluffed his income? Maybe there was, dare i say it, fraud? We simply do not know. I can go on and on…
And of course no one can say for sure what his situation was when he originally bought the home. Only CW & his LO know that.
I dont mean to sound insensitive, but my point is, is that life happens and it’s not always ideal. He might not be able to afford it now and he sure deserves to keep his home, but if he cannot afford it, he cannot afford it. We dont see blogs and blogs about people’s cars getting repo’d for non-payment. Again, life happens.
I do wish someone would start tracking forclosures with not simply the statistic but track the statistics of WHY the forclosure occured.. all the reasons above are a start to the list.
E-Mail me your thoughts…emilanderson@gmail.com
alot of immigrant in here not all dont speak good englsih or dont understand englsihnot too mention even american who speak good englsih get fooled too.
some people could tell right away if this guy easy too fool the crooked could read it already epecially in this country if u have limited english but ur a hard working people or have a job who open credit, buy a car or buy a home those people dont even know what APR mean or pre payment.
people can as long the broker dont like to those people and base there income and how much they could afford in there monthly mortgage payment see those banks or lenders dont care they want more because of lax of lending and the federal are sleeping that time that’s why this thing happen and those greedy brokers taking advantage to the system. i think you know YSP if i’m a greedy brokers dsont think for the buyers and the feds are sleeping due to lax of lending some brokers take advantage to the system the greedy brokers know some home buyers qualify for prime rate good loan or terms because his greedy and because of that YSP i could get more money or commision why would i think of that homeowners or buyers interet if things fucked up i dont have skin in the game anyways.
Lookinthemirror:
What country are you living in? Of course, people are going to blame the enablers. We put drug dealers, arms dealers and child pornography peddlers in prison don’t we? You are absolutely correct that both lenders and homeowners are to blame. However, you tend want to let the enablers off the hook a little too much. American’s tend to believe if there was no one pushing drugs it’d be a lot harder to get a hold of them and use. Same theory for homeowners looking for a quick fix. Enablers are a huge part of the problem.
You keep stating that people need to seek out other opinions and lawyers for help on loan terms. Lawyers cost money and when you’re paying your loan officer, escrow company and notary to provide services, don’t you think due dilligence puts them in position to do right by the customer? Homeowners are not just paying loan officers to give them a loan, but to match them with the very best loan for their circumstances and finances. Why should you or I have to pay extra money to get fair and honest services?
easy for you to say it like you think all understand what thety are sgning for if they get lied by a motivated greedy crooked borker he will get that job done that what happen to me all i wanted is to have a shelter for my family i’m not those people buy to houses at the same time or flipped it and sell it right away i need only aplace for my family and work hard and pay my tax.
LOOK IN THE MIRROR
are you really this close minded or do you just shoot smoke into your own mirror.
What i am saying and have said. if you trust your professional then you trust them….. meaning you take their advice as fact because they are your professional.
I only used the cancer as an analogy – you have really blown it into a whole nother level… GEEEEZZZZZ i will try in baby terms to see if you can see them through your tunnel vision.
if you go to a DR who is a professional in his field of medicine, this is a DR you trust and researched before letting him be in charge of you health, you would take his word, his advice, his diagnosis as fact. (like a borrower trusting their broker)
Now is this doctor stated the lump was nothing in his examination. you take as fact because you trust his professional opinion. you don’t get a 2nd opinion at this time because you already trust him to be your primary care physician.
as you stated in your reply ” “if something doesn’t feel right get a second opinion” I would hope that if you have been trusting this individual with your healthcare and you researched him beforehand you wouldn’t get that doesn’t feel right feeling or you would ask him right then and there, wouldn’t you.
To then find out a few months later that he missed it or gave you a bogus diagnosis to just collect his payment from you or your insurance – would probably piss you off. it is after all your health here. so then after you do confirm later that it is cancer i bet you don’t trust that Dr the same way anymore. you then reach out & try to find solutions. I am also assuming you didn’t plan to have cancer when you signed the dr’s papers and diagnosis charts etc.
So to convert that analogy to mtg is:
if you found a broker that you trust and feel comfortable with, and you trust his/her professinal opinion in your financial matters . When going through the process you ask questions, you get to the closing you ask questions only to be told by your professional what it is you believe to be fact. When in reality you are being told 1/2 truths or whatever it takes for you to sign your mtg. You trust this professional that the explanation of the program, doc & payment to be accurate. You have done what everyone has said here you ask for explanation of your docs. So again you would be pissed off too, to find that the broker/bank/title/appraiser/realtor etc etc was not 100% honest with you and your family on your biggest investment of your primary home (this afterall is the shelter you are providing your family) so then you go and question the bank the broker everyone to find solutions to the problem to save your home.
Why did my payment double? why is there a prepay? why are the original 1003 and other docs not here? why didn’t you provide me with a GFE within 3 days of my signing the application? WHY DID YOU LIE TO ME, WHY DID YOU MISGUIDE ME? i think that is all legitimate questions to ask when you find out you got bad advice on your loan. Most of the regular working people do not know the rules or regulations or anything about the mortgage industry, if they did they would not need mortgage brokers.
So Look in the Mirror, how exactly is it the right thing to do to sell your house now? when you owe the bank more than it is worth? would it be better for you to sleep at night to know another family is out of their home or lost all of their savings in a bad real estate deal? why would you want someone to walk away from their financial responsibilities rather than find a solution with a loan mod and face up and pay? why is it ok in your opinion for some of these bank to have allowed such shitty deals to be funded using investors money and brokers to have made thousands of dollars on them and the borrower paying the price with high interest rates?
I don’t think that is ok !!!!!!!
Here is a solution:
Modify the loans, the investors will still get paid, the borrower can continue to live in his home and pay back his debt. The bank Countrywide and Angelo Mozillo will just have to settle for making a few less $ every month, but will have saved homes & families without the taxpayer dollar.
Please feel free to offer a healthy solutions vs throwing people in the street to ruine their credit. walking away from your home ? that is your solution? that is just adding to the problem. Find SOLUTIONS !
and Look in the Mirror
who are you to tell me to take this loss and rent as I always should have been. it seems your parents should have spanked you a few times and taught you not to judge people so quickly. For you information i have been a homeowner for many many years and am here to give an opinion just like you. you are just to close minded to see the whole picture.
Clear the dust in your own mirror and look at yourself !!!!
Be kinder and open minded to people. These losses are hard, the economy is hard on many. I hope you never find yourself in a bad situation – i wonder who will help you – what goes around comes around. so stop adding to the problem and stop kicking people while they are down -
oops missed on important factor. You make $2000 per month and signed loan documents for $448K? You expect them to lower the payments on HALF A MILLION DOLLARS to how much so you can make the payments?
You make $2K a month and agreed to payments of $2K per month? How is this countrywides fault?
Well this should do it for the big liberal American socialist experiment (at least for the next 40 years, or unless we elect Obama). Funny how the same people defending this guy — who will ultimately lose his home — are the same people bitching that the lending practices are not fair.
Here’s the way we buy a house: 1. Get an education. 2. Get a job to support yourself. 3. Pay your existing bills on time. 4. Save. 5. Put a downpayment on your purchase and finance it based on 1 – 4.
way too go Moe !
you stated it short & perfectly !
Look in the mirror doesn’t seem to understand the whole situation
Anyone bother to look at the big picture:
as you stated; “I dont mean to sound insensitive, but my point is, is that life happens and it’s not always ideal. He might not be able to afford it now and he sure deserves to keep his home, but if he cannot afford it, he cannot afford it. —–Again, life happens.”
Life does happen & I think that it is ok that he is trying to save his home. I commend him for atleast having the guts to pick up the phone, write an email whatever to save his home. it says something about him. Atleast he did not sit on his ass and say well the hell with it, if I can’t afford it anymore so i will live mortgage free for the next 10 – 12 months before they even foreclose or evict me. Mr. Bailey tried to reach out for help. If he made a bad choice, got dealt a raw deal and he can’t pay it anymore well then he will have to live with those choices, but again, atleast he tried to do something to find a reasonable repayment plan or loan mod to pay his mtg.
As you said life happens and I am sure none of us planned for this industry or this economy to get this bad and it will only get worse.
Good luck everybody ! I am wishful for solutions across the board !
in my situation i try to do the right thing i told them straight CW i’m having trouble paying my monthly it just happen this month only i’m behind and my family willing to help me but they wont help me if countrywide wont modify my loan my family is not obligated cuase they are not the the loan only me i’ve been paying since 2006 now i wast just asking for help so i wont be in delinquent or be in default i dont want to walk away but if they not going to help me then i have a reason to walk away i wont waste my money that my blood and sweat i work hard that money and to pay it for my mortgage but if i cannot afford the monhly i was just asking if they could lower it and fixed my loan them i’m willing to pay it on time and i dont have to worry to be delinwuent or i will not be indfault or not behind nomore and my family willing to help me too but if they are not going to help me i did submit 3 harsship leetewr since last year and latest last may not happen now i’m behind last one and this month june 2008 i have 15 days grace period before those late fee added up if i cannoit get help from them i will just wait the house to get foreclose or maybe file bankrupty.
Re: loansafe.org, Moe,Steve and Scott,
I had an interview last Sat. with this company for a homeowner consultant position. I did not get the job.
Above and beyond,
whom ever believes this is a lender or homeowner mistake for these loans being written, I do not care!
What is the solution?
Who has a better way to fix this problem?
Do we let every homeowner and bank that engaged in a bad loan that has no ability to be repaid at the current payments fail?
Underwriting was way to loose and homeowners were just as greedy as the banks! Everyone is in on it!
My bigger concern now a days is that all the Brokers and LO’s that were part of the problem loans are now writng loan modifications. S C A R Y !
LoanSafe is one of the very few companies that is really putting a solution in place to get this mess worked out! I have watched Moe’s site grow since last September, and they really have helped a lot of homeowners. They are not pitching some Hail Mary, B.S. They help the homeowners that can be helped.
Do you like the San Diego “Walk away” solution better?
So please, Whether you like Moe or the loansafe organization. Or not. I would like to hear some solutions? How else can this be fixed? For the homeowner and the banks?
No more woulda,coulda,shoulda B.S!
If it was up to you, to contribute to the solution regarding this problem, What would you do to fix this mess?
Thanks
KellyG
HEY EVERYONE HERE IS A SOLUTION:
Every person who has a mortgage loan ( first, second, heloc) all get the same low rate fixed for 30 years. no refi’s allowed for the life of the loan. The rate should be locked at the Feds rate. They lowered it to help the borrowers and the banks did not pass on the savings to the borrowers.
i am sure this will totally boost the economy, if people, homeowners; can actually have money to spend on something other than a mortgage, & gas to get to work.
Anyone have any other solutions?
Not every salesman, loan officer, or even doctor is a liar. Unfortunately some are which is why you sign documents that list all the details of the agreement.
What more do you people want?
Rates are up a 1/2 today otherwise there might be a $1m in refis on this blog.
what the used if countrywide are not willing to help you or modify or loan not even repayment i did 3 harship leeters already since last year around sept.2007 then the 2nd was february 2008 and now lasy may 2008 countrywide not even bother helping me or calling me 3 negotiator already saying to me we cannot help you.
I love this guy——could not be stated any better:
Loanguy on Jun 5th, 2008 at 11:53 am
I have been following this thread for awhile and I am wondering when people are going to realize that these people should have never been given a loan in the first place. Sounds like he was way over his head to began with. I also am a believer that if he was willing to sign his name on the dotted line with out a gun to his head then he should man up and pay his bills or sell. I am tired of reading articles and post from people bashing mortgage shops for borrowers dumb mistakes. I don’t know about you or anybody else on here, but if I am going to make the biggest purchase in my life then I am goin got know the terms. Maybe uneducated people shouldn’t buy homes because that’s essentially what I see here and in many other cases, or the buyers are just playing stupid!!!
Hans- in your country, would they let you get away with this whinny shit or make you man up. You are not welcome to come here, apply for the dream then bitch when the dream doesnt come true.
Seems to be a one way street, as we are not headed out of the country.
KellyG
i completely agree with you !!!!!!!
stop the BS and lets find solutions – that is what i have been preaching since i found this blog.
as for loansafe.org they are on the right track and they will be as honest as possible with you, they give you guidance and alternatives. & if you can’t be helped with a loan mod they tell you, no BS. They try to help those that truly can be helped.
Jessi:
atleast that is a positive solution and it won’t keep clogging the foreclosure courts. better to have people in their homes paying a lower mortgage than out on the street.
Renting won’t be easy as most rental properties are also being foreclosed on by Greedy borrowers or banks or realtors or underwriters with loose guidlines who allowed this to happen and now the economy is so bad they can’t afford the investment property
Lets find solutions for the homeowner who lives in the property as their primary residence:
yeah talk shit all you want maybe ur one of the investors or who own countrywide stock that’s why you dont feel what we feeling right now.
if we could only do loan to those who were smart enough to read big words like ‘interest’ and ‘escrow’ we would not be in this mess. So, lets blame the education system, and if they are to blame, lets blame the govt and if they are to blame, lets blame whoever elected the President and if he is to blame, lets blame ourselves for being able to type 50 wpm on a blog instead of kissing our kids or taking a run or donating your time to charity or jumping off a bldg cause we are miserable little brats.
As i am reading this and as harsh as lookinthemirror sounds, I have to agree.
Mr. Baily as sad as the situation is signed the documents, then signed them again knowing his income. Funny how he has an attorney now to show how he got scammed again but did not go to this attorney before he signed those documents. The accountability is gone!
Hans, when someone tells you this will change in 6 months, usually it will change in 6 months. You can not sit there and hope on a wing and a prayer that it will not change too much. You knew signing those papers that there was that chance when you told the loan officer you could not go over $2000 a month. I agree, he/she is probably looking out for his commission but why weren’t you as passionate about your well being. I think in any language there is a saying “if something sounds too good to be true, it probably is” Sorry about your situation but again accountability.
stupidisasstupiddoes:
there is no way that there will be 1m in refi’s even if the rates went down a point.
WHY? because the property values are no longer there !!!!!!!
95% of the CountryWide Borrowers owe more on their loans than what the home is valued.
so people trying to refi wiht a different bank to get away from CW can’t even if they are not facing foreclosure and pay on time.
so Loan Mod is a win win for the investor, the bank and the borrower ….
we need Solutions do any of you have any?????
dipshit, CFC stock is at $5 a share, thats $40 lower than their 12 month high.
Translated: me dont happy about my money go bye bye
Really Sad: ?
how is it that the bank keeps lending him $ if he can’t afford it? Countrywide has his financials and docs.
Countrywide requires all borrowers going into the loan modification process to provide 3 months of bank statement, a full month of paychecks, current debt and income ratios, last 2 years of taxes & w2’s… among a few other things – so how can CountryWide offer him something after reviewing his documentation if he can not afford to pay them back???
Understand that CountryWide and their soldiers were doing what was necessary to shut Mr. Bailey up and dangled a cookie infront of his saying this loan mod will save your home and CW lied.
so i for one am happy he got an attorney to sort through allt he CountryWide shit and I hope they go further and start analizing every file.
Carrie-
YOu gotta get some facts, stay away from blogs. 95% of CW loans are over 100% LTV, that seems pretty high. Guessing that number is closer to 5%, but am truely not sure.
FHA will go to 97%, you bring the difference in cash. Oh, no cash. Then short sale to an investor who is dying to accumulate inventory so he has something to sell next housing boom. Sure you will be one of those eager buyers looking for 100% loan with seller concession.
Gotta go, got some new tenants moving in and some rent checks to collect. If they bounce, who do I blame? Can I get some relief from the govt? And if my car doesnt start, ooooh, I am gonna start a blog like no other!!
u keep insisting that you thoink all people they know what are they signing for all i know i thought getting or buying a house is easy crooked people in this country know there’s alot of non speaking english immigrant i know little only but not alot or deep ingish they making money for people dont even know what APR like creditr card all they know easy to get credit card fill up the form but not all know the interest rate . you should be happy because people like you making money from immigrant will this country build by immigrant anyways even white settlers are immigrant evebody know ur from england ].
well for me if c=CW dont want help me so be it i dont worry i could live renting again it much cheaper i ‘ll just walk away simple as that learn my lesson
Here’s a solution, lets forgive all the loans and let people live in the houses free regardless of what they owe or could
pay.
We could call it communism.
The message is the banks are trying to work with people who can afford to make the payments. If you can’t afford them, they tell you its over, you dont qualify. Why would they make another loan if you can’t afford it anyway? (other than mr baily apparently).
Just because the bank offered you the money doesnt mean you should have taken it.
Carrie,
he had the same information. It is his house, his loan, his life. WHy did HE sign! He knew according to his bankstatements, paystubs and so on the he could not afford the loan.
I just bought a car not too long ago, wanted the BMW 6 series. They would have approved me but I KNEW I could not really afford it. Bought a vehicle in MY budget because I knew what i could afford. Would you have not done the same? You sound reasonable, I am not saying that he was not in a tough spot but why go there again. He got the attorney too late, I am sure the attorney would have advised him the same thing, not to sign.
If you didnt understand the language you should have got an interpretter to explain it to you. You are an adult and responsible for your own actions. Quit trying to blame someone else.
stupidisastupiddoes
STREAMLINE (like FHA) no credit needed
What if the banks would re-write the loan to a payment that was 35% DTI of the homeowners income. Carry the negative balance for around 10yrs @5 interest only (deferring the balance)
Sure it’s a negam (for the carried balance), but then they wouldn’t write down the protfolio today. The whole loan amount would be in tact.
Homeowner can pay
Less foreclosures
Inflation takes over and covers the arrears (homes rise again)
slows down the home price “free fall”
homeowners income rises (to cover future mtg.)
adds stability to the housing market
Banks don’t have to re-capatilize billions to cover future biz
New buyers come into the market with confidence sooner!
It’s a rough outline, but whats your input?
so why dont u asking question too if the lenders know ’cause i know they have all there customers or homeowners file if some people like me cant afford the monthly mortgage why would they approved ther loan due to that lax lending some crooked loan officer find away to get the done deal lying telling the buyers its okey or coaching them and now lenders and investors whine tooand why it it is thousand of CW homeowners are owe more than what there house is worth like me they want to keep me and keep on paying and i told them i cannot afford already and they even know my imcome was stated at the first place why would they let this happen?
what u mean interpreter they dont offer you interpreter they even told me your okey you speak okey english so hut the fucked up
now they try to fast a law so if ur immigrant and dont speak good englsih they will provide if what language your speaking just now because its to late already the damge has been done
Someone had to write the loan, probably someone who knew he would not be able to afford it, but could ‘refi before it adjusts’ and during that time ‘fix their credit’ to ‘qualify for a better rate next time’
ya.
and ‘make 2.5 ysp’ in the process.
I am sure there are some contracts you all don’t understand, and rely on a 3rd party for guidance… of course if they are crooks your are really screwed.
I am sure that the appraiser, broker, retail LO, R/E agent, Title closer, Buyer’s Attny and Bank Attny were never to look at its all the borrower’s fault. The loan docs are so simple to comprehend there aren’t volumes thick laws and codes regulating the shit.
idiots.
hans,
How much do you owe on the house?
how much do you “really” make?
how much is the home worth?
how much are your current payments?
how much are rents in your neighborhood?
AND DO YOU YOUR REALLY WANT TO KEEP THE HOME?
Do you want to complain? Or do you want a solution?
Give me the info above, and I will give you a solution, RIGHT NOW!
KellyG
ask CW if they offer interpreter long time when this mess is not yet blown up they hwere busy screwing small people just to make millions of proift now all of a sudden they dont originate subprime loan %80 CW loan are subprime otrr liar loan or toxic loan or etc.
Hey I went to an anti-American, kill whitey, homeowner’s rally in South Chicago last night and a “church service” broke out!!!!
$448,000 interest only and it going change every 6 months may monthly payment is $2,193.33 last time i talk to them it said i’m not sure the value now in my newighborhood its wast 350,000 up somewhere so the value when down when i get this loan i never had down payment ’cause the agent or broker told me you dont need down payment you could stil get a loan so okey and CW told me when i wass giving them my hardship leter when i talk to them that who ever did my loan they stated my income to $8,000 my mom,my one sister and one brother where helping me but they stop cuase they wasting there money i could afford paying the loan with there help but ther are not in the loan title or somrthing it just me i try to tell CW i have family will willing to help me as long if thet put my loan into fixed rate and they continue helping me if i’;m the only one i cannot afford it for my income $2,000 amonth nnow last month they stop helping me they where willing to help me again if CW fixed my loan i told thewm i ahve family willing to help me but they dont want to waste there money if i keep paying interet only since 2006 its $448,000 til now i’m stil paying interest only and the house lose value already so why would i keep paying the house if i owe more dan what the house it worth if me and my family help me cause whe spilit the payment into 4 person not they backing out so if only me i cannot afford nomore i was behind last month already if countrywide want to work with me they going to help me back my family
if there’s a chance to keep the house why not why did i send them 3 hardship letters since last year and they dont even bother calling me it just if i’m the oly one paying for it i cannot afford it if 3 of my family helping me then i will be okey but its not okey with them cuase the house lose value and they are not obligated cuase they are not in the loan i’m the only one i each one of us me,my mom.one sistere and one btohter could afford if they put us into fixed rate i could or each one can contribute $1,000 ech if they put us into fixed rate but they want me to keep paying interest only no vlaue of the house nomore and every 6 months can might go up or not my family just rather rent buck again instead paying interest only
I feel sorry for people that got caught in the housing bubble. Fortunately, some people were conscientious enough to pay attention to loan documents that they signed. If they felt “pressured” by loan officer’s, realtor’s, title people, etc., maybe they should have done a bit more due diligence. I just don’t get it??? HOW CAN YOU SIGN A NOTE AND DEED OF TRUST THAT IS NOTARIZED AND RECORDED, AND NOT TAKE THE TIME TO REVIEW THE DOCUMENTS THAT YOU SIGNED, AND UNDERSTAND HOW THE PROGRAM WORKS?
This is not rocket science. If it is too complicated to understand or read, the answer is simple……DO NOT SIGN THE PAPERS!!!! Why is this so difficult to understand???? I don’t get it!
you want peaope to understand it not easy for you 2 say it if the buyers dont speak good englsih or print it to there own language not just english i bet you if there is fishy in the contract they run away right now from the deal.
they implement that if your taking driving there’s a pamplet every nationality even in hospital they give you interpreter you think if that crooked broker or loan officer will waste his time to give you interpreter if he think he could take advantage of you i dont think so you guys keep saying if you dont speak englsih that’s your problem this country built by immigrant even white people they are immigrant it just that they own this country now all people in thius country speak englsih buy alot hardworking people those just job that people in this country wont gonna do it most off them immigrant some speak good englsih some limited they work hard some they get paid good and they buy home and borker screwed them up. cuase the crooked broker guy know some of them know or could read the person in front of the door if he dont speak english i’m not saying all those bad loan offcer and brokers only.
Hans,
Sounds like you answered the question- Do you want to keep the home?
house lose value already so why would i keep paying the house if i owe more dan what the house it worth
Sounds to me like you don’t really want to keep the home. Am I correct? If so- you better see an attorney.
I think you were expecting CW to pull a rabbit outa their hat.
You stated your payments are $2193.00 interest only.
Thats less than 6%? Interest only?
What do you really want CW to do?
If your late at less than 6% Interest only. I can’t really see them working this out.
CW would be better off dumping the home for the lower value (25% less than what the home is mortgaged at)and getting the money now!
Are you expecting CW to drop the balance and the rate? Most unlikely.
They can get away from you and the home and have a chance to re-coup the $$$ within a few years, than work with you!
Sorry for the bad news- Better pull out the “for rent ads”
Bright side- I did give you the solution I promised you
Bottomline- the modification has to be a winner for both sides-
you did a loan with “straw” borrowers helping you pay. You are not a true “hardship” case. You and the family got a very good interest only loan at 100% cltv! Stated! Thought you would live the american dream? It happens, it’s like a bad stock trade, gotta know when to BAIL!
If I missed on this one Carrie, please let me know!
This doesn’t sound like a true hardship
Hans- how much is it to rent a home like yours? Just curious-
kellyG
Go back to being a renter. That’s what you are. That’s what you should be. That’s your place in the housing market. And that’s what your place was when you purchased your home. We are all very sorry you didn’t make a killing on your projected sale like you thought you would, and we are done bailing your ass out.
Make your payments, get a second job, quit drinking Starbucks, sell the gas guzzler SUV (you know, the one you bought your wife for “safety reasons,” get rid of the porn channels and HBO, and live within your means OR F***ING MOVE so your house becomes a performing asset which benefits this country!!!
Hans – move the fuck back to where ever you came from. I for one am sick of your whiny ass, nonsensical ramblings. This country doesn’t owe you or anybody a goddamn thing except an opportunity and you have obviously fucked that up royally.
you think ’cause you give advice you think you feel great your not in my side i know you dont know what its like when monthly mortgage come so dont come here that iwasnt struggling what can i do if my family not helping me i’m the one who get this loan by myself not them u cxall that not stuggling when i’m the one now stuck for it even family are not there for you in time of trouble not all so dont give me that your better something screw u and CW mozilo anyway ssaid it already some of the CW homeowners those are underwater are disgusting like dan bailey but he’s saying to those all underwater or delinquent or in default
why u care bryce nimrod why u both CW stock and your not making money the u both from CW how much share did you buy asshole!
Hans,
I really do feel for your situation. As of now though you sound like you are trying to justify “walking”? It does happen to the best at times. Only you can make that decision. If you really want to keep the home- rent some rooms out, or as Shorty and Bryce say- cut back on purchase and get a 2nd job. It’s tough all over. If you really want to make this work you WILL! If not-do what your gonna do! Sounds to me like you already made up your mind?
Have you sought proffesional help? loansafe? Attorney?
KellyG
shorty racist cunt what a stereo type u talk to immigrant like me huh amrica is changing now wwhere going to have a first blaack american president people like u should get fucked by bin laden c’uaser ur a fucking narrow minded
Hans-
seems your english just stepped up a few levels!:)
shorty racist cunt what a stereo type u talk to immigrant like me huh amrica is changing now wwhere going to have a first blaack american president people like u should get fucked by bin laden c’uaser ur a fucking narrow minded
stupid people you want people to have second job that’s how cheap life in here when your old your going for home for the agent. that’s what lender tell you get a second job so you could pay me big time they dont care if you brick your back just get another job that what they ask me first dont you have a plan to get a second job just to make up or pay or mortgage what kill my self to get a second job bullshit!
shorty talk shit to me i’m i talk shit to him simple as that if your nice to me then i’m be nice to you if your asshole then i’m asshole than you
I cannot understand how it is always the mortgage professionals fault..I understand and agree that there were many LO’s that were not qualified for their positions..(as well as some AE’s and underwriters)And they may have taken advantage of the average consumer..Let’s not forget that they (LO) made a ton of money…and they (homeowner) usually pulled out lots of money…So this appears to be tit for tat…I am not buying all of this “not understanding” business. I know that those option arm loans were quite confusing…BUT when there is a clause that talks about the “negative amortization” that your loan WILL have…What more do you need to understand..If you are making a payment based on 1% but your note rate is 8%….How smart do you have to be to understand this is BAD!!! People have hardships and things happen in life..I understand that..But I agree with one of you above about people living beyond their means…I was an underwriter for 15 years..(lost my job in August, but still have my home) Do you know how many stated loans I saw where the borrower’s were two school teachers and the application stated they each made well over 7k a month?? We all know they did not make that..And we all knew they could not qualify for the home they were buying…where did they think they were going to get the money to make the mortgage payment? That has nothing to do with understanding…You can either pay or not…If you have to have a neg-am type of loan just to qualify for a particular home…..YOU SHOULD NOT BUY IT!!!! Are you kidding me!!But as the underwriter you could not call the borrower or the broker a liar, you could only ask for documentation to verify..And guess what..When you did this they would just take the loan down the road to the next lender who did not care…So I guess long and short of it is this…..We are all grown-ups and have responsibilities..and we were all to blame in this Mortgage Crisis…I am tired of hearing that is all the lenders and mortgage professionals fault!! That is just stupid….GROW-UP and be a man! (so to speak)I am not sure what the outcome of all this will be…..
shorty and bryce talk shit first like fucked u want to get nasty you thing i give a shit nobody give a shit you here in america i only feel those people in my situautin but you guys are not in my situation right now so get lost
Hans
I find alot of value in “free time” and NO 2nd job!
Again you have answered the question-
Do you REALLY want to keep this home? It seems to be a BIG NO!
That’s ok. Just do yourself a favor and seek legal advise!
Good luck
KellyG
beyond there mean if lenders or banks should not approved this at a first place if they follow guideline this things will never happen no matter what because there’s a loophole or lax of lending brokers, taking advantage to the situation appraisser inflate the value so if the guy want to buy a house like me then get paid $2,000 only they should not approved me first place
While Dan’s situation is regrettable, I still wonder how Countrywide did him wrong? Dan never stated that Countrywide did his loan originally, merely that Countrywide was the servicer. And while Mozillo’s comment were stupidly made public, his sentiment behind them was correct. Dan can ask for a loan modification, but Countrywide is not OBLIGATED to give one. We never were provided the full terms of either loan to make a comparison. Countrywide did Dan a service by granting the modification, and did so as a gesture of good will for the negative publicity. If Dan can not still afford the house, maybe he should ask for forebearance and not a free loan. Countrywide did not take advantage of Dan. Everyone has gone a little to far in their presuppositions, we just don’t have all the facts to judge.
stupidisasstupiddoes:
a have a friend who worked in the CW office here locally doing subprime loans in Miami, FL — they did do a lot of 90, 95 & 100 % loans !!!! full knowing they were stretching it in every direction. they were allowing guidelines to be as loose as possible. 6% seller concession, creative financing etc…. you name it, it was probably done.
so yes CW is part of the problem & yes greedy realtors, brokers, appraisers, title co are part of the problem & yes so are some of the buyers…. But can we for one second stop pointing fingers everywhere and realize that we are in a crisis.
we need solutions !
i did not say all broker some of them first place i was the one approach by a broker my friend give my name to the brokern and he screwed me up simple as that
I just love how everyone has an their views, but no solutions as to how to get this market back on track. If you guys are suppose to be professionals why not act like it and cut with the cuss words and piss poor attitudes. This is why our country is the way it is. All the negativity and noone to work on the problems. Forget the fact we have foreclosures, that happens all the time. Our problem is how do we get our country back on track, employee our people and live the american dream.
i’m the one who get screwed by this broker then i have to live it if its not only a crime to kill i chopped that mutha fucker into pieces
this people in the pro-CW telling you dont have hoped that’s how i see it i try to pay ontime when you had a hard time paying the loan and ask for any little help they try to put you down i try to work with my lender they are the one who’s not willing to work out off course we know they are not on our side.
REALLY SAD,
i agree with you that he never should have signed this loan mod without legal advice if he knew he could not afford the payment. that is what MOE was saying at the top of this blog, CW scrambled and tried to shut him up quickly, but it was not efficiently…
but in the prior post to you – i was refering to the original 2 loans he made with CountryWide.. Why didn’t they use the 3C’s of banking -
where were the guidelines, the true underwriters that went beyond a credit score to determine risk. Why did they originally lend him all this money?
I too live within my means, but it has gotten harder & harder the way this economy is going….
lets see if we can find a common ground for everyone and some solutions… poverty sucks so does recession — i just can’t stand by and let people starve even if they have made mistakes. to errr is human and day by day people keep losing compassion and this is not good for anybody.
to those like Look in the Mirror, stupidisasstupiddoes etc. I am soooooo happy for you that in your world everything is so perfect. but reality is everyone has some type of problems on some level maybe not all financial, could be health issues, could be teenage kids with drug problems, could be single mothers trying to raise their kids and work and juggle everythin inbetween…
Please lets all of us work together to help your fellow man and find solutions….
most of the people here seem intelligent !!! with educated comments even if they differ from mine, i respect that -
Out the window with CW, they were greedy, I also agree that life happens and everyones situation is different and we shouldn’t lump everything together and try to be biased in analyzing each situation.
All I am saying is I don’t blame him for seeking help….
solution if only contrywide reduce the principal and base it with the current rate and change the term of the loan ofr each homeowners into affordable loan but CW scared they might get sued from there investors so they dont want to work out that why nohting gonnna haqppen in here if both parties dont compromise.
solution works if both parties compromise nobody’s perfect things happen economy get affected how about people like us want to work out if we could only get help and put us in better position.
Chuck Beef – \
glad to see you here
love your thoughts, agree with most of your posts !!!
this is a true mess huh???? we need to work together to get this economy back on track – we can’t seem to depend on our gov’t & regulations, that is part of the problem that got us in this mess to begin with.
Escrow Officer:
I 2nd that. you have a GREAT point in your last post.
Kelly G:
I believe your heart is in the right place – i think Hans might be acting a little reads like a latin accent at times, a uneducated amerian at times & a russian at times. a bit confusing . I am not to happy with CW either myself, but I too think Hans should seek the advice of an attorney.
I have called their customer service lines and very unprofessional at times, vague and no CSR at all. but hey if you are lucky to get that one individual who knows what they are talking about and can actually help you , get their exact name, extension etc. because those are few and far between.
DOES ANYONE HAVE SOLUTIONS? or are we going to keep at each other?
aite people good luck GOD BLESS AMERICA no matter what i love this country that’s the reason i’m this country it just between me and mt lender
carrie..I agree with you..that there is to much negative talk..and most of us seem like professional smart people. I just think that this is a such a large and diverse problem. Someone mentioned above that there has always been foreclosures..this is nothing new..But this time it is different..We have so many different reasons for the foreclosures..It used to be simply because of hardship “loss of job” “illness” etc..It was not because people “had loans they did not understand” “people bought above their means” “loss of equity” “just plain walking away” This may sound a bit hard..but I can think of one solution..I feel that if you are just “walking away” because you have lost to much equity..but you can make your payment..SHAME ON YOU…there should be some sort of penalty to you…I don’t think that you should be allowed to contribute to this problem..Because our values will continue to decline the more foreclosures there are…I know that it is not realistic to think that a lender would be able to determine how or why someone is in foreclosure..But i sure would love it if they did..A home is supposed to be a longterm investment..And also what ever happened to “being thankful for what you have” I think that this is a very big case of “Keeping up with the Jones’
INTHEBUSINESS:
There are so many things that have caused us to get to this place, the Bush admin, the greedy banks (CountryWide for one), the Realtors, the Loan Officers, the Mortgage Brokers, the Title companies, the Appraisals, it was all a chain, those that looked the other way & knew they were doing wrong will pay sooner or later – some are already paying by parking cars or flipping burgers. Not all in the industry were bad, but for those few good people, the rest of them have done them in. there are those buyers that knew exactly what they were doing & did it taking a risk (to flip a property or pull out all the equity etc), but it is true in your last statement some people did try to keep up with the Jones’s and others have truly fallen into hardships. Foreclosures have always been around but never like this to this extent.
I am hoping for Solutions – hoping to save my home & my families sanity… Children need to know that they are loved and we need to provide that plus shelter, & food.
a House is a piece of property you never truly own, even after you pay the bank, you still need to pay your property taxes, but there are those of us who chose to make it a home for the longterm and for our family & by many different circumstances are finding themselves in a ‘hardship’ I agree with you inthebusiness that if the banks took the time to evaluate each situation and find a common solution between borrower & investor would be great ! that is what they are suppose to do in the loan mod dept. if you can ever reach them and those in that department have more files on their desk than they can get too. they are overworked also, & they are human tooo & can not get to every file in time. so we need to do our part.
God Bless you all ! we are not alone ! in Unity we find strength. Thanks again Moe for allowing all of us to voice our thoughts.
SOLUTIONS is what we need to get people out of this mess, SOLUTIONS to get the market back on track and SOLUTIONS to get the economy back to normal — whatever normal is –
as I stated in a previous post this morning:
“Everyone is to blame to some extent, but i keep saying it over & over – we need solutions somehow, someway …
Instead of you all attacking Moe for allowing all of us to learn from each other and here each others opinion in an open forum, we should use that same energy to help others. PAY IT FORWARD !
Be kind to your neighbors, Enjoy your family, love your kids, plan for the future and learn from yours & others mistakes…
Courtesy can be contagious , and any acts of kindness no matter how small will never go unnoticed !!!
Voice your opinion and stop the hate, & remember everytime you point a finger you have 3 of your own pointing back at you! ”
MOE, YOU continue to ROCK !!!!!
Sincerely & Respectfully,
Carrie
Miami, FL
I am Franz and you are Hans — and we’re here to. . . f*** YOU UP.
No but seriously, if you are that much of a dumbass and trusted this broker who, by the way, probably has just a bit more than a high school education, with your financial and personal future, and he did you in like you said he did . . . this IS America. . . go find him and shoot is ass. ‘Cause brotha, ain’t no court ’round here that’s gonna get him.
And don’t forget to blame Bush.
some of you need to read MOE’s original post we are getting off track here.
Moe was showing how the bank, their CEO and their execs are still pulling stunts.. he used Mr. Bailey as an exmple.
with over 125 posts here already there are a lot of people out here pist, angry or truly trying to help.
here are my 2 cents.
Mr. Bailey should have never signed this last loan mod without consulting an attorney first. He should have given himself a budget first before contact CountryWide and offering them true #’s & facts and a possible solution… with that being said…
I strongly agree that this is a FUBAR of a mess… not just for Mr. Bailey but for all of us.
Mr. Bailey has a right to his opinion as well as fighting for his home. even if poor decisions were made or even if he is in this situation because of true hardship — but if he can’t afford his home anymore, he can’t afford it anymore – but he has the right to check & fight after all those years in the property. Don’t be so harsh on him and if he is unable to save his home I wish he learns from this mistake and move on.
EVRYONE in one way or another is to blame and those of you completely defending the lender and broker without taking any blame are part of the problem and were probably doing dirty tricks toooooo.
NOW, we need to find a way to clean it up.
it is like your 3 kids, grandparents, spouse everyone getting into a huge heated argument, throwing glass and pointing fingers etc bring up the past & future and mixing up situations in between ‘you promised to buy me a new guitar — you promised i could buy a new bike’ etc) responses fly back, ‘we had a cut in hours at work ‘ ‘ i did not forsee your mother getting sick and medical bills piling ‘ all the while no one listening to the others needs or new situation or not even remembering why the argument truly started, it could have been as simple as sitting at the wrong chair at the dinner table — BUT if one would stop, take a step back & try to mediate we could see that if everyone worked together, they could sweep up the broken glass from the floor, ask the other for forgiveness, learn from the each other mistakes and learn from each others wisdom. no one is perfect – OBVIOUSLY THIS IS ON A MUCH BIGGER SCALE but none the less i’m trying to get my point across.
How is that saying that if you have nothing good to say don’t say anything at all -
well *****
I remember something my mother use to say –
“Treat others as you would like to be treated”
WOW powerful if Everyone would apply it.
Thank you Moe for allowing myself to voice my thoughts and opinions…
No one answered the question asked earlier?
was the loan written by CW in the Bailey case?
My understannding is that it wasn’t. CW just has the servicing.
Does anyone know for sure?
Carrie?
SHORTY WANNA THUG: HERE ARE ALL OF YOUR POSTS THUS FAR:
1)Shorty Wanna Thug on Jun 5th, 2008 at 4:43 pm
Hey I went to an anti-American, kill whitey, homeowner’s rally in South Chicago last night and a “church service” broke out!!!!
2)Shorty Wanna Thug on Jun 5th, 2008 at 5:26 pm
Go back to being a renter. That’s what you are. That’s what you should be. That’s your place in the housing market. And that’s what your place was when you purchased your home. We are all very sorry you didn’t make a killing on your projected sale like you thought you would, and we are done bailing your ass out.
Make your payments, get a second job, quit drinking Starbucks, sell the gas guzzler SUV (you know, the one you bought your wife for “safety reasons,” get rid of the porn channels and HBO, and live within your means OR F***ING MOVE so your house becomes a performing asset which benefits this country!!!
3)Shorty Wanna Thug on Jun 5th, 2008 at 7:22 pm
I am Franz and you are Hans — and we’re here to. . . f*** YOU UP.
No but seriously, if you are that much of a dumbass and trusted this broker who, by the way, probably has just a bit more than a high school education, with your financial and personal future, and he did you in like you said he did . . . this IS America. . . go find him and shoot is ass. ‘Cause brotha, ain’t no court ’round here that’s gonna get him.
4)Shorty Wanna Thug on Jun 5th, 2008 at 7:23 pm
And don’t forget to blame Bush.
SORRY I COULDN’T FINISH BEFORE :
SHORTY WANNA THUG – you probably are a thug or need some rehabilitation;
take your nasty comments and judgemental butt back to school.
in your 2nd comment you are judging people and making assumptions
you know what they say when you assume
you make an ASS of U —– grow some pubic hairs, learn to respect others hardships before uttering your garbage
SHORTY WANNA THUG – you are ignorant and a part of the problem
Kelly G,
I will have to research through the posts where Mr. Bailey states his original case & hardship letter.
If I remember correctly Mr. Bailey did have his loan originate with CountryWide and then took out a second loan (refi)
MOE???? do you have the answer for KellyG since you spoke with Dan Bailey.
Yo Car, here’s the deal: I was referred over to this site by some other site saying that this site was defending deadbeats who were gaming the system. And, quite frankly, a Goddam form letter is gaming the system. And from the looks of things, Hans is too.
CW, as a fiduciary to the entire banking system, is trying to claw themselves out of a mess our wonderful congress created. I refer to this creation as the Michael Milken Mortgage Traunch to make homeownership inclusive of all.
And what a catastrophic joke this is. The failure of socialism has reared its ugly head. We actually created a market for this crap out of thin air and lowered all measures of underwriting reasonableness to satisfy whining political interest groups. Then we have the audacity to sell it to the world!!!
On a macroeconomic level it’s no wonder our dollar is worth dick as our assets tank because they are failing to perform.
So, Hans, move. And when you move a more QUALIFIED person who has done the four of five things that FNLiberalExperimentOver outlined will move in. That new person will make the payments and the system will once again work until another tinkering, “homeownship is exclusive, racist, blah, blah, blah” lawmaker in Washington f***s it up again.
When will we learn? But I guarantee one thing. . . the same people who are bitching here, are the same people who elected the Bozos who put this whole thing in motion. And I ain’t talking about Bush or his “hands off” kind.
And Car: Thanks for the synopsis of my posts. As long as somebody hears OUR side. . .
MOE POSTED THIS ON HIS BLOG ON JANUARY 15TH 2008. ( THE BLOG WHERE CHASE WAS HELPING 98% OF THEIR LOAN MODS)
TOWARDS THE END OF HIS POST HE STATES:
This is something I have been advocating since day one. Give everyone loan modifications that deserve it and if they default after the loan modification, then they deserve to go into foreclosure. (unless it is a new hardship)
Plain and simple. This isn’t rocket science and there are too many homeowners losing their homes because of the incompetence of these lenders and servicers loss mitigation departments. It needs to stop and we need to hold them accountable!
This is business and also a bit of human compassion mixed in. You sold them or you now service their toxic loan, now give this “human being”, “American homeowner”, “mother or father” a break and help them stay in their home. Stop lying to the media and American people. When you say you don’t want to take people’s homes, back these claims with real help and data to back it up. The media lip service must stop now!
MOZILLO ARE YOU LISTENING :::: STOP THE BS ! & help the borrowers who truly need it. stop delaying the help !
for those who don’t qualify, let them know asap so they can move on – & begin rebuildin their own lives…
Is there a reason they won’t even look at your loan for a loan mod until you have been with them a full 12 months making payments?
Is it because if you default on your loan before the first year they have to buy it back?
let me know
I would like to know just a couple things.
1) How long did Mr Bailey have the loan because I find it a little strange that he is at “110% dir” after such a “great” loan modification?
2) How did Mr Bailey get approved in the first place because whether he understood the terms of the loan or not, I’m pretty sure that he would know 1 and 2 are not the same or in other words he would not be able to afford a payment larger than his income?
IGNORANCE IS NOT INNOCENCE!!!
Ryan
thanks for your comments on the forum – you do make a valid point – the ignorance of the bank to lend him the $ in the first place when his DTI is well over 100% is ignorant…
Fucknards unite.
Wow, what a busy little site this is! “And it’s linked with so many pro-economic, pro-lending, and pro-do-what’s-right sites,” he said tongue and cheek, laughing at his fellow man.
Is George Soros behind this crap, or do you asswipes really believe that playing this high stake’s game with your financial future is prudent?
Look at yourselves. This is pathetic. Let’s get off the internet bandwagon and get productive. Go back to work and pay your bills.
Apparently this site is making news, however, since other sites ask “us guys” to post our thoughts after reading it.
It’s very sweet that the man and his company that brought so many people into the housing market is called Tangelo, Crooked, has shirts made with his likeness, and is demonized.
Instead of saying, “Shame on you,” I won’t, I’m just going to laugh while I manage my properties with my loans from Countrywide (and while I make the payments).
I say, “Thank you Tangelo.” If not for you, I would not be a homeowner OR a landlord.
Carrie you live in la la land. Mozillo is not listening to you. He is trying to run a company where some of his clients look at this site who try to breach their contracts. He is trying to overcome people like you who should be telling people who come here to go see an attorney – not copy and paste hardship form letters.
See, this site is linked to so much bull crud on how NOT to make your payments, all credibility is lost for those in REAL hardship.
Oh thank goodness very few people know about this web address. You people are better off going back out and marching on the streets. But I guess that is not very effective either. America will move forward and do the right thing. Most of us do not have time for this foolishness. Somebody will kick you out of any house whether you own it or not if you do not make your payments.
For all those people who are in financial trouble, I sincerely feel for you. Unfortunately, you are now in a position in which your destiny is driven by others. Looking back, I am certain you would never have purchased that home, no matter how low those payments “appeared” when you saw them in writing. Now, you are learning the hardest lesson in life: Trust, yet verify. If you are facing a foreclosure situation, I suggest that you do the following:
1) Contact your lender and see if they will work with you to modify the loan.
2) Reach out to family/friends (if that is an option) to try and help you with your financial situation.
3) If options 1 or 2 do not work, then I would recommend that you allow your bank to foreclose on you. It is a tough lesson to learn, and will impact your credit for a long time, however if it makes financial sense, than you must do it. You will need to start over, however you will start over with more knowledge and understanding of how the world really works.
These are the only alternatives for people that are behind in their payments. We all have to face the music at one time or another in our lives, and sometimes we all learn valuable lessons. The lesson to be learned is not to purchase ANYTHING that is above your means, and if you do, realize that there are consequences to that decision. You can play the blame game all day long, however, it will not improve your situation. Just choose one of the three options above, and move on with your life with the fact that you learned a valuable lesson. Life is not fair, and the sooner you realize that, the better off you will be. Just be thankful that you are not starving in Darfur, and you will feel much better immediately. Take action in trying to better yourself instead of trying to blame others for your financial problems.
So Moe, we never did hear back as to what Mr. Bailey did with his prior refinance to get his cash-out. Maybe he did debt consolidation to lower his DTI and improve his credit rating and since then, has racked up a bunch of credit card debt to off-set his life style…thoughts on that? We are truly only hearing one side of this story so if you really think that you have this story pegged Moe, why not do your true due diligence before you go yapping around making it everyone else’s fault but Mr. Baileys for his unfortunate position in life right now.
Question:
What company was the originator of Mr. Baileys mortgage loan. I have heard that it WAS NOT Countrywide that originated the mortgage. CW somewhere down the line inherited his mortgage loan as it was purchase from the mortgage broker world. CW is one of the largest mortgage servicers as well so I can imagine that they have purchased a shizit load of toxic mortgages and Mr. Baileys sounds to be one of them.
I wonder what he was doing throughout his 3 day recission period. Must have been sweating bullets awaiting for his $100,000 cash to go spend with thoughts of never repaying the loan!
Jesse,
You stated in an earlier message:
“So Look in the mirror when you are sick do you not go to the Dr to find out what is wrong? Do you not take his word of a professional? It would probably piss you off if your Dr told you that the small lump you felt was nothing to later find it has grown into a Cancer”.
You know what I would do and most everyone? Get a 2nd opinion prior to making an important decision in life.
True or False?
Great North…
Women in generals get lumps in their breast during their monthly menstrual cycle….
But if you were going to a routine check up with your professional doctor and he said that it was nothing. you trust his opinion afterall you researched him and chose him as your Dr to be in charge of your health
same thing for your broker : you chose them to be responsbile, & professional in his field to guide you through the purchase of your home. The reason you go to them is because you don’t know how to do it your self and you trust him that he has your best interest & will be honest when explaining docs and programs etc etc…..
it was just an analogy – a different way to look at it…
NO not everyone is perfect & Yes everyone is to blame on some level but GREAT NORTH what solutions can you offer?
GREAT NORTH: as for Mr. Bailey $100k in your previous post
what are you talking about????? he did not receive any cash on a loan mod. & many of the loans CW did originate were very toxicccccc
Dirty Sanchez I am not in lala land as you state, i just try to see all the sides to a story>>>>
I try to be optimistic and give everyone the benefit of the doubt. so I keep saying it everyone has a little blame in this current market condition, but we don’t need to keep pointing fingers we should find SOLUTIONS…
this is what i said
MOZILLO ARE YOU LISTENING :::: STOP THE BS ! & help the borrowers who truly need it. stop delaying the help !
for those who don’t qualify, let them know asap so they can move on – & begin rebuildin their own lives…
All I AM SAYING IS LETS GET HELP TO THOSE WHO TRULY NEED IT…
& THOSE WHO CAN NOT QUALIFY FOR A LOAN MOD LET THEM KNOW
Foreclose on them or what ever the necessary steps are….
& NO I DID NOT TELL THEM OR Mr. Bailey to copy and paste a hardship letter. I don’t agree with that, but I understand that Mr. Bailey used it as a guide to help him tell his story..
I believe that if you tell your situation in your own words it is better, but if I did not know where to start, felt lost I would reach out for help or guidance (from a friend, a spouse, a parent, a forum,) whatever tools where accesible to me.
There is nothing wrong with people helping people.
or Dirty Sanchez, would you have thought it better that he did nothing , sat on his ass and did nothing? waited 10-12 month for them to evict & foreclose on him and then move on???
NO,
Lookinthemirror your post on Jun 5th, 2008 at 10:29 pm
Actually makes a lot of sense. I knew you had a heart in you.
All I am saying is that people here can not only blame the borrowers for the current situation, although they need to be responsible for their actions. Everyone in the industry is to blame in one way or another.
So if he tried to reach out to get help there is nothing wrong with that, & if he was denied the loan mod he should be able to accept that & move on. But if he does qualify he & anyone should be taken care of. That’s all.
There are some people who are truly going through a HardShip & yes there are those who BS and deserve nothing. Just like there are good brokers & bank execs there are also greedy f***ed up brokers & bank execs with no morals or ethics.
Just be open minded and try to walk in someone elses shoes before you judge you have no idea what their journey has been in this life.
MOE or anyone Question:
A co-worker asked me & I did not know the answer:
Is there a reason they won’t even look at your loan for a loan mod until you have been with them a full 12 months making payments?
Is it because if you default on your loan before the first year they have to buy it back? or is it for other reasons…..
I live in Miami, FL
just so some of you can grasp how bad it has gotten here….
a house in my neighborhood in 2003 was sold for $350,ooo by the end of 2006 it was appraised at $635,ooo.
it went up almost 300,ooo in 3 years…. are the borrowers responsible for that?
same thing with condos, and houses in other areas here., now they have depreciated almost as fast & some people can not re-fi
the market, the banks, loose guidelines/programs, A/E’s, brokers, Loan officers, title companies, appraisers, AVM systems, etc etc…
all had their hand in the cookie jar of GREEEED.
They through out their morals, common sense along with their ethics.
& NO I do not think they are all bad, but the bad ones have given the rest of you good guys a horrible stench right now.
Same for borrowers: some have true Hardships, but they are being bundled with those who are trying to get a better deal.
Carrie,
Again, thanks so much for being a voice for homeowners and swindled borrowers everywhere. I am used to being attacked because I have been putting myself out there for a year now and this is just part of the job. Maybe I should be on dirty jobs or something> Do porn spam attacks and verbal attacks and threats constitute a dirty job? LOL.
But in all seriousness, I am humbled by your comments and I am also motivated in ways that only words like you type can do. I need you and the homeowners need you. So keep up the good fight!
Nye Lavelle,
You are a pioneer in the proverbial den of wolves. You have been fighting mortgage disservice now for years and you are a role model for me and consumer advocates everywhere. Nice talking with you yesterday and I look forward to working with you soon.
KellyG = Thanks! Please call me.
And to all the thoughtful comments, whether for or against Dan, I respect all people’s opinions, no matter how much I disagree with you.
As far as the personal attacks on me, I know that these attacks come from people who lack in self esteem and have intense inner rage. I am glad that I can help you all with blog therapy and maybe, you will not get road rage and kill someone for cutting you off on the way home from work today.
Peace and Love to ALL! Even Mozilo and Countrywide.
Jesse,
Mr. Bailey had to refinance for some reason if he owned his home for over 13 years and was down to a small mortgage balance (previous article). Why did he choose to refinance and increase his mortgage balance? So when borrowers refinance and cash-out for whatever reason(s), shouldn’t they be accountable for what they have done with the cash they sucked out of there home to either invest, pay off credit card debt, but that awesome boat or car etc.
The cash was used in some way shape or form. It seems to me that Mr. Bailey knew exactly what he was getting into but needed the cash. I think he is as guilty as anyone in this transaction until proven innocent. I also would like to know what company originated his mortgage loan as I heard that it was not CW. CW is only the “servicer” of the loan so in theory, the biggest loser in this situation right now has been CW by purchasing a crappy loan profile that was originated by someone else. This is a nationwide issue so I think it’s time we back off the banks as they are suffering enough and those banks that are balls deep in those toxic loans, they will eventually fold.
Like Kelly & Carrie state, how can we move forward in a positive way to help save us all from further equity losses. I know my house has lost almost $35-$40,000 in value which is huge when you consider I live in a small town where the average house is around $130,000. We all are suffering in one way or another and some like Mr. Bailey, made a bad choice or ran into a difficult position financially and the bank is probably preventing the inevitable (Bailey will not repay and foreclose anyways as he is probably buying time to have a place to live and/or sell) of foreclosing. Why should the bank have any interest in holding on to a pipe dream?
your entire day is spent thinking and commenting about Mozilo and CW, they only own 20% of the market and much of that came thru brokers.
Are you really wishing peace and love to the 50,000 CW employees and Mozilo, who has no problems carrying the burden for American greed in its entirety.
Oh and Hans, not buying the language barrier crap.
If you cant ’speak’ English that is one thing (annunciation) but your inability to type it or use the spell check function on your computer means you are a lazy deceiver who is probably whiting out his w-2’s so he can apply for a Home Depot card.
Ships leave everyday back to wherever you are from. Please walk away from your house, spread the word in your country how bad it is here and go back to growing potatoes.
Carrie,
I have to respond to this. I read yesterday that 1M homes in the US have recentley foreclosed. Let me ask you a question: do you truly believe that out of 1M people, they were all duped by crooked brokers, LO’s, etc.? Again, if you read my post, I explained that we are all to blame to a certain extent and of course there were less that honest brokers that sold them loans that weren’t the best for them, but doesn’t this happen every day in every type of business to a certain extent? Of course it does. What were the brokers supposed to say: if you take this loan sir, theres a good chance that you might lose the home because you don’t understand how the libor works and two years from now the payments WILL go up? What if you went into a boat shop and asked for a speedboat and the sales guy told you you could drown if you bought the boat? You get the point.
Look, the bottomline is this: owning a home is up there with having children. If you can’t handle it then don’t do it. You can’t make bad decisions and expect other people to bail you out. Of course there were probably some situations where people lost their home due to unforeseen hardships, etc., but my guess is that is the exception to the rule don’t you think? You say its greed, but weren’t some of these homeowners greedy for the American dream? Absolutely.
As for what my parents taught me, it wasn’t to shift blame to others when things didn’t go my why. Thank Christ they didn’t. Theres enough of that going on already. Thats why America doesn’t produce anything, build anything or create anything any more. We are a nation of consumers that want everything and we want it now. Carrie, what you want, whether you know it or not is country of people that have no responsiblity for themselves, no accountability and depend on the government for everything. This is known as marxisim, socialism or communism. I will pass personally.
Frank,
Where are you located?
I am in Southern California. Most of the jobs here are in the financial service,and building industry. We have had an enormous amount of layoffs in these fields due to the current economy. These are homeowners that did understand the loan docs that they signed. Unfortunately companies in these fields have either downsized or closed. Gas prices have increased so much that employees who commute a distance to work have found themselves strapped for cash also. I don’t believe this is an attack on Countrywide. They have had layoffs also. I can guarantee ex Countrywide employees are seeking loan modifications for their own homes! This is an epedemic of enourmous proportions. To be so closed minded and think it’s just the homeowners with a lack of knowledge, is absurd. I know many intelligent people that have been laid off, or incomes that have dropped in this same situation. So again I ask the same question as earlier-
What will you do to contribute to the solution?
KellyG
Hans wants CW to reduce the principle…hahahahahahaha, that’s the funniest thing I’v heard ever..
WARNING: My name is Moe and this is my blog.
Just a little blog to fill a need on the internet in regards to loan modifications and what lenders, servicers, the government and the media are saying and doing about it.
I AM PRO CONSUMER AND FOR CAPITALISM. I AM AN ANTI-CAPITALISTIC PIG FIGHTER OF CORPORATIONS AND PROFESSIONALS THAT TAKE ADVANTAGE OF CONSUMERS BY SELLING SNAKE OIL AND CALL THIS PROFITS!
I operate a business that does mortgage document reviews for consumers who are victims of greed and crime. I get paid well now for all the crap you all sold over the years and I save homes in doing so.
WARNING TO THE HATERZ OF THE TRUTH!!!!!!!!!!
Usually I do not delete comments but if you keep being stupid on my blog, then I will delete your comments. Yes, take a few pot shots at Moe, big deal, but sometimes, enough is enough. So, naturally you will waste your little huffy puffy time writing up a big response to Moe and I just hit delete. Unless
Why? Because this is my blog, that’s why!
I sleep well at night knowing that my websites and company have helped thousands while many of the capitalistic pigs services cause people pain and suffering. They now are so miserable they have to come here on my little blog and vent and pout because they are in denial.
I repeat, this is just a blog and my name is just Moe. This is not the New York Times, LA Times or Business Week. Just a fricken little blog ran by me on my laptop.
I do wish peace and love to Countrywide and Mozilo. Maybe the peace and love will spread through their veins and they will do what is right.
Yes, he is an ass, but so am I sometimes. His ass is orange and mine is white. I don’t discriminate him for the color of his ass.
I care and feel for ALL suffering human beings.
I repeat this is just a blog and I am just Moe……..carry on
Whatever … You are still a douchebag
Moe-
As someone who occassionally does loan workouts for a distressed consumer, the first thing I ask them is to take the ‘I am a victim’ out of their case.
Once that is established, then the workouts actually…work out. Why? Because they have taken ownership of the problem and now are singularly focused on the fix.
If you keep coaching the victim mentality, we are never going to get past this problem.
We should call you Reverend Moe and give you tax exempt status on your income.
this blog is losing steam, have you seen the one at http://www.iwantmymommy.com
today 6-6-08 to those who homeowners under may situation if you owe more than what your house is worth forget it dont rely or dont bother no more ask help for countrywide i just talk to them awhile ago to the lost mitigation dept. and i called HOPE ALLAINCE for help i give all my information to the counselor and she talk in behalf of me and countrywide dont have option or help to those who have option ARM,interest onlly, if you have 2nd loan ofrget i just talk to them 10 mins ago along with the help of hope representative councilor even short refi or other option if your behind already 1 month in your mortgage doest matter nomore they tell me straight that they dont have option in my situation i’ve been paying since april1, 2006 if i know i wont get any help so atleast somewherte last year or around 2006 i should walk away so if your homeowners and countrywide have your loan and you have those toxic loans forget i did give 3 time hardship letters since last year and this month i have hope counselor representative so we talk on the phone in loss mitigation dept. of CW 3 ways tell me straight they dont have no optionn if your owe more than what your house it worth they told me sell it so for me i could live bad record for 7 to 10 years instead making easier for countrywide to ’cause there investor are not willing to modify my loan so if you guys keep on dreaming that countrywide might have sympathy on you forget just walk away dont make easier from them to that’s up to you guys if your like in my situation i’m just 1 month behind asking for little help but no help from them good luck for those who is underwater and if oyur countrywide homeowners good luck too.
Just in case the voyeurs of this site don’t speak liberal, please allow me to translate:
“Moe Bedard on Jun 6th, 2008 at 1:11 pm
WARNING: My name is Moe and this is my blog.”
…….Meaning- Since this is mine, you will play by my rules; this is not a forum for spirited discussion (complete with all that comes with it), but for me to espouse my drivel.
“Just a little blog to fill a need on the internet in regards to loan modifications and what lenders, servicers, the government and the media are saying and doing about it.”
…….Meaning- I am trying to antithetically convince you that this is meaningless drivel yet I will try to otherwise convince you that “the system,” (e.g. lenders, servicers, the government and the media) are all scum. Note: Although each entity is exclusive of each other, there is some validity to it. :-0)
“I AM PRO CONSUMER AND FOR CAPITALISM. I AM AN ANTI-CAPITALISTIC PIG FIGHTER OF CORPORATIONS AND PROFESSIONALS THAT TAKE ADVANTAGE OF CONSUMERS BY SELLING SNAKE OIL AND CALL THIS PROFITS!”
…….Meaning- There is no such thing as fair play or a fair deal in the capitalist society we live in. It’s never win-win; only the “rich” win.
“I operate a business that does mortgage document reviews for consumers who are victims of greed and crime. I get paid well now for all the crap you all sold over the years and I save homes in doing so.”
…….Meaning- To validate my existence, I shall proclaim my services are that of an expert witness, or otherwise mortgage professional, to help those breach their contracts because no matter what you did with the money you pulled out of your home, no matter how little you put down, and no matter how you live your life, you are a victim of predatory lending one way or another.
” WARNING TO THE HATERZ OF THE TRUTH!!!!!!!!!!
Usually I do not delete comments but if you keep being stupid on my blog, then I will delete your comments. Yes, take a few pot shots at Moe, big deal, but sometimes, enough is enough. So, naturally you will waste your little huffy puffy time writing up a big response to Moe and I just hit delete. Unless”
…….Meaning- YA, I WILL SILENCE YOU, MEIN KAMPF!!
“Why? Because this is my blog, that’s why!
I sleep well at night knowing that my websites and company have helped thousands while many of the capitalistic pigs services cause people pain and suffering. They now are so miserable they have to come here on my little blog and vent and pout because they are in denial.
I repeat, this is just a blog and my name is just Moe. This is not the New York Times, LA Times or Business Week. Just a fricken little blog ran by me on my laptop.
I do wish peace and love to Countrywide and Mozilo. Maybe the peace and love will spread through their veins and they will do what is right.
Yes, he is an ass, but so am I sometimes. His ass is orange and mine is white. I don’t discriminate him for the color of his ass.
I care and feel for ALL suffering human beings.
I repeat this is just a blog and I am just Moe……..carry on”
…….RESPONSE APPROPO- Already stated by:
“go fuck yourself moe on Jun 6th, 2008 at 2:37 pm”
“Whatever … You are still a douchebag”
Thanks Moe for clearing that up. I wondered
why my post never made it. You deleted it!
I, like several others, was attempting yet
again to invite you to explain how it is you
seemingly come by the most private of information
that allows you to make so many “blanket” statements
about so many other people and to invite you to
openly share your “other” business ventures.
WTF has asked the same of you several times as well.
Maybe it was my statement about the many folks on
here who dislike loan officers/originators and blame
them for their current situations (legitimate or not) and that
I wondered how they would feel about you if they
researched some of your many businesses. Just exactly
what are your “services” with respect to mortgage loans
on manufactured housing? Would these folks start to question your heartfelt attempts at assiting them with “canned” modification requests over their misrepresented mortgages
originated at the hands of greedy originators? By the way,
Moe, just exactly what are your services with respect to
mortgage loans on manufactured housing? Yes, I am asking
the question a second time because I think even more
people would like to know and would appreciate your
clearing up any confusion with respect to the possibility
you are working folks from multiple angles for your
own advantage.
Louise,
Do you promise you’ll stop bugging me? Please, pretty please Louise and your side kick WTF???????????? How fitting……
I delete your comments because you and people like you are wasting my time. Why do I need to answer to you and WTF? Come on please!!!!
The reason why I am now is because I want you to just go away.
I could easily delete, but I wont, this time, so I can explain what you are losing sleep over.
I am a webmaster who operates websites that help people. That is my profession and now I own a forensic loan document review company that helps people too.
That is it.
I full fill needs in our society that are not being met and I try to do my best to provide accurate information sprinkled with my own flavor because this is my blog. The information I obtain is readily available on the internet.
I do not sell loans. There is a website that I built and marketed that assisted people with manufactured home loans where they own the land.
Manufactured Homeowners are and have been discriminated against by loan officers, brokers and lenders. Many of these people can’t refinance and cant get help when they reach out for it.
You know that this is specialty financing and if you know anything about mortgages then you will agree. Most seasoned LO’s don’t have a clue what to do with a manufactured home, yet these people still need help. So, I knew the lenders and I connected the consumer with them.
I know what you’re thinking Louise, genius, huh??!!!!!!
There were no option ARM’S and crazy loans for these homes.
It is a website Louise. Just like this blog. Get with the times because websites are a great way to help people and get paid.
Imagine that???!!!!! The internet is fabulous isn’t it?
I get paid because I help people and full fill needs in society and on the internet, while you grovel on my blog about what it is I do.
Talk about WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
so if your a homeowner and countrywide own your loan there investors in the wall street whoever own a slice of our loan they package them into securities and slice and dice it that the reason why they dont want to modify your loan specially if you dont have equity,interest only that they base it in LIBOR index for 6 months itll change every 6 months,option ARM,ALT-A jumbo loan they are all toxic so if your behind like me like a month if you own more than what your house it worth just walk away if you want to make revenge from greedy lenders they just want you to do short sale for there own interest so its easy for them if you let it go and walk away they are buying time countrywide they want you guys to pay your interest only nothing happen so if your underwater dont wait nomore just walk away if you could lived with that they fucked us in the first place wall street pigs,lenders,banks,real estate agent,loan officer,brokers,appraissers and the fed’s due to lax of lending that why all this greedy fuckers are on cahoots this is the biggest scheme in america because they lobby in the congress that is why there’s a lot of loophole. so its okey to save or bail out bearn stern and now countrywide stock is junk and BANK OF AMEIRCA are buying countrywide stock for billion just to save them buy more time while the son of the butcher MR ANGELO PIG MOZILO UNLOADING HIS SHARE OF STOCK AND DONT CARE NO MORE FOR HIS OWN COMAPNAY THAT HE BULIT. SO WALK AWAY DONT MAKE EASIER FOR CW like that short sale they want you to do just walk away let it foreclose .
Yes hans, and would like like a coke and fries with that? Thank you and drive through please.
FRANK:on Jun 6th, 2008 at 10:47 am
i agree with most of your post. except for the last few sentences..
I do agree that there are homeowners who bought beyond their means & should find a solution(either rent or downsize),
I do agree that there are homeowners who were greedy too and bought 1 too many properties and now are sinking because of the economy
I do agree that some signed it taking a risk like in any
business. Credit card companies take a risk when they issue a credit card to a consumer ( but $10,000 credit card does not compare to a $450,000 mortgage) -
The banks are not obligated to help anyone, I understand that.
but it doesn’t hurt to ask for help when you are in need (true hardship).
if you fall off a bike and can’t get up, should you crawl all the way home or ask the kid next to you to help you get up?
NO I DO NOT WANT AS YOU STATED: “is country of people that have no responsiblity for themselves, no accountability and depend on the government for everything. This is known as marxisim, socialism or communism.”
I LOVE THIS COUNTRY we have the freedom of speech to express ourselves etc etc… I do think people need to be responsbile for their actions ( borrowers, lenders, banks etc) the people that played dirty should be held responsible either by losing their home, their license, their business… & no i don’t want to depend on the gov’t for everything They are part of the problem and part responsible why we are in this mess (meaning the economy, the realestate/mtg industry, etc)
I for one put a large sum of money down to purchase my home, also was responsible enough to save 8 months of reserves beyond the closing costs & our credit scores were in the mid 700’s i consider myself responsible and able to move from my condo to a home….. both my husband & I are working and have 2 kids. I consider myself lucky for the most part – There are a lot of people in a worse situation (like single mom wiht 2 jobs raising kids she doesn’t have enough time to see, or like someone whose spouse became terminally ill etc etc) But after becoming unemployed last year & going through our reserves, I didn’t expect the economy to get soooo bad. So I called the bank and asked for guidance or help for my situation & was treated less than professionally & told several times by different reps that unless I was atleast 2-3 months behind they wouldn’t even look at my file.
So here I am trying to do the right thing by calling CW and advising them of my financial situation and how & why it has changed and what can we do to make arrangements to continue a good business relationship & I get treated horribly. so the bank would rather me forget about obligation & debt with them before they even think of a loan mod?
oh & i did use the CountryWide Loan officer who did unethically sign most of my paperwork and did not disclose all the docs correctly nor provided me with a GFE until the day of closing with the hud. What this loan officer promised me when i spoke with her & did the basic application was one thing completely different than the day of closing….
This loan officer knew I had already sold my condo, had my furniture in storage & had been staying in a hotel for about a week already, this loan officer knew the developer was giving 6% seller contribution & still had me bring a lot of money to closing and she knew that I had given a huge down payment(which was held in escrow) this loan officer knew that the developer was not going to extend my contract nor give back the down payment, because it was written in black & white in the sales contract. So do i think she took advantage of me on some level HELL YESSSSSS. She made a lot of money on just my deal and don’t believe she had my best interest at heart. It was difficult to walk away from the closing table that way, in part yes because of the dream of owning our home to raise our family, in part because i did not want to throw away thousands of thousands of dollars my husband & I had worked so hard to save.
She said the difference in payment from what she promised was only $600 month more & that was nothing with the salary I was making. so we signed. YES I DO UNDERSTAND THAT THERE IS RISK INVOLVED IN EVERY INVESTMENT. but we had planned for risks with reserves. we just did not plan that the industry had gotten so bad and the economy had as well, gas prices, food prices, and that i would be unemployed along with sooooo many others.
She wouldn’t return my calls when i got into my situation, i only received one email stating sorry to hear about it. good luck to you and No we cannot refi your property has depreciated over 80,000 since you closed a few months ago? This loan officer used her appraisal company, charged me origination & discount points up front, which by the way she said this was used to buy down my rate LOL HAHAHAHAHA
with my credit score & reserves & income i got a 7.5% on the first, 10.5% on the second.. oh & by the way i found out a couple of weeks ago that the YSP between both loans was 3 points.
i was told this had no prepay but got slammed with one –
SORRY I AM JUST VENTING I GET PISSED ALL OVER AGAIN at her &at myself.
So YES I am happy to have found this site because I have learned from everyone on all sides and now I feel that on my next transaction I will be more prepared and know what type of questions to ask and now I know how to read the closing statement better. you remember the saying ” if only I could go back in time with what I know now” well yeah i feel that way.
I am a grown up and will face my responsibilities the best way I can. If the bank does not want to help me, my family and I will pick up the pieces and rebuild & move on. But do not blame me for atleast trying to save my home. Would it have been better for me not to call them and not pay & wait to see what happens?
How would you feel if you lend me $1000 & i promised for the next 5 months i would pay you 210 to pay you off with some interest, & after the second month i did not call you and just disappeared? Shitty huh?
I think you would much rather me call you and tell you listen I fell into this situation can I pay you 100 now and then pay you 160 for the next 4 months. you would have to agree of course, but i think you would respect me more for being upfront about my situation and giving you my face, than not paying and running from my obligations, don’t you think?
For the record I do belive that there are some good ethical brokers out there as well as good bankers etc. But the ones that have no morals and no ethics have given the rest of you a bad name right now and they should be held responsible for what they did. I am hoping that things can get back to normal. There have always been hardships and foreclosures, But not to this extreme extent in such a short period of time.
I just want solutions that will help all sides, get the good realtors, brokers and bankers back to making a living, getting rid of the trash & greedy ones. Clean up the banking industry with guidelines & good underwriters & ethical employees, get help to the borrowers that do deserve the help & have true hardships.
MOE, I TOTALLY GET YOUR HUMOR …
People wether you agree with him or not, MOE is allowing us to meet & discuss different opinions and hopefully learn from one another on his blog, for that I am grateful. Even I don’t agree with him all the time, but I am open minded enough to try & see his point of view along with yours…
MOE MOE MOE —–
I just read your last post – boy balls of steel i tell you.
you are alright man !
some people get it , some don’t – i hope the ones that don’t enjoy their great life and never fall into hardship, because KARMA is a bitch.
What did they think that you live off this blog??
They have their opinions and you have yours you were just smart enough to see the problem that you were dealing with on a daily basis and smart enough to start a blog on it and it is full of traffic and comments. Do you think they know how to start one?
Maybe they can ask someone for help, oooopppsss sorry that seems to be a no no in their book (”don’t ask for help & don’t ask for handouts” author: negative commenting energy sucking bloggers).
You and everyone else has the right to make a living.
Get paid for your services and keep sleeping well at night.
way to PAY IT FOWARD !!!
CAN ANYONE IN THE INDUSTRY ANSWER THIS QUESTION:
Is there a reason they (CountryWide or any bank) won’t even look at your loan for a loan mod until you have been with them a full 12 months making payments?
{they have your credit report when you purchased your home and they see you have no lates for years on your previous mortgages.}
Is it because if you default on your loan within the first 12 months of opening that loan the bank has to buy it back?
or is it for other reasons ? ? ?…..
(Hans) it is going to take CountryWide months & months to foreclose on you, they have thousands of files on their desk. so live in your home mortgage free, save your money until you get the eviction notice and hopefully you will have saved enough money to not ever fall behind. U will probably be able to rent at a low price since the market is full of empty investment properties so you can probably get one cheap, ride out the storm there for the next 2 years. work on rebuilding your credit meanwhile (keep paying your credit cards and other bills on time)- & hopefully when the market gets back to some normality at affordable priced homes you can buy again. most banks have guidelines that will not allow you to buy if you have lates, foreclosures or bankruptcies within 24 months. so just wait 2-3 years and hopefully you will have learned your lesson and learned how to budget. remember to keep saving !!!!! FHA has really low rates. DO NOT do a short sale – that really screws your credit and you will be out money. Foreclose & save.
Carrie,
you would need to get the complete original file to break this one down.
original- loan to value
income- was it stated or full doc
job verification- what was the job history stated? was it self employed?
Assets-what assets were shown on the 1003?
reserves-how much was shown in reserves?
It’s hard for me to believe that someone was totally wiped out in less than 12 months from purchase date. unless of course the homeowner or the L’O did some really crafty cutting and pasteing!
I would check this out with the homeowner (get the full story)
This sounds like the homeowner and the L’O might have done something shady.To get this deal done. Make sure the homeowner is completely honest and open with the documents.
Tricky situation!
Carrie….maybe you should be out trying to find an alternate source of income or something productive that might better your situation, rather than posting on this blog all day long.
thanks jessi finally i’m willing to walk away now i’vew been asking help for CW since last year 2007 i did 3 harship letter since 2006 i was paying ontime i’m only behind last month my counselor from HOPE who help me awhile ago they talk for in behalf of me to CW loss mitigation and they told me there’s no option for me or anykind of help there’s not they want me to pay interest only since 2006 its $448,000 til now its till $448,000 so i gues they just want me to keep paying interest only and the house is devalued it already now the last month soposed the payment for the mortgage i will save it i’m not gonna pay it nomore i’ll wait till it foreclose or i will get evicted so to those homeowners like in my situation right now dont dream that CW will help you your just wasting your money you work hard for that that your blood and sweat and they just want you to pay interest only or those toxic loan that they sold to you guys save that money trust me when that woman from countrywide i talk too awhile ago telling me straight i dont have option or they could not help me just sale your home will do shirt sale i told them straight i will not make easier for you guys to i rather foreclose it than do short sale good luck to all.
justasuggestion:
Can you come down & take care of my kids so that I can get a second job?
I am with my kids right now on my laptop, on the couch trying to vent and find options & solutions, so that they don’t see mommy stressed & crying… and trying to cope with what is happening and finding comfort in knowing that I am not alone.
I am grateful to have found this blog – i have been going nuts for months since things got really tight and I feel peace when I am here.
FYI: I work FT during the day, my husband works FT night shifts & graveyard. & here is something for you….
DAYCAREs & CHILDCARE SERVICES that are open in our area from 6pm to 12 midnight charge anywhere from $120 to $165 per child. so lets multiply that by 2 that would be $220 to $330 per week.
So how much do you think the salaries are at a PT 2nd job?
lets say $10/hr x 5/hrs x 5 days = $250 gross about $215 net.
so after putting gas to get to this second job there isn’t enough for childcare. do you have any suggestions now???
justasuggestion, when do i get to see my kids if i am always working? buying a home = American Dream? BullShit !!!!!
Lately most americans can’t afford to go to the movies, take a vacation or take their kids anywhere… its heartbreaking !
it is happening to many here in my neighborhood, same with some co-workers, same with other people everywher…
MAYBE ALL YOU NEGATIVE HATEFUL people attacking me would rather see us living in a car, give up on everything, turn my back on responsibilities and walk away from years of savings I invested on a home i wanted to raise my kids in & take your tax dollars at welfare????
I am not that kind of person and do not wish to be one -
I want to work, pay my bills and live an honest life.
I fell into a hardship and all I did was ask for help what is wrong with that?????
I am trying to do what I can to save my home. Wouldn’t you?
Dont preach to me about hard times,and this economy, Carrie. I LOST MY HOME IN JANUARY. I was in a profession as was my husband for over 15 years and was able to afford my own home for many years. In 2006 my Husband lost his job, and we got by on my income for a time. Then he got a job, then I lost MY job, then him, then me and so on and so on. We did everything we could to hang on, sold our posessions, took any job we could find that would pay the bills and keep food on the table, had yard sales, borrowed from friends and family until finally we realized we were way over our heads and it was time to move on. We put the home on the market. We finally got an offer after 6mos, had to submit a short sale package to the lender becuae by then we were upside down. The lender didnt get to it in time and the house wound up going to sale. Game over.
My point is, we didnt expect the lender to clean up our mess. It was not the lender’s fault we were upside-down and broke. We stayed in contact with them, took every suggestion they offered, and lost it anyway.
Now, we RENT. Because thats what we can afford now, based on our income. I have kids, I have paid for daycare. My husband and I spend hours commuting to and from our daughters high school, so she didnt have to change schools.
My point is, we tried , we struggled and finally we came to the realization that we couldnt afford our home so we had to move.
we dont believe you easy for you to say it your not in our side maybe your pro countrywide just lying us here telling us dont tell me about hard time you should not discourage homeowners in here if you put all your money saving in the house and it just like that it going for nothinbg and your home are going to foreclosure the way you talk your not those homeowners that is struggling i too have job work hard that money i put in a home is my blood and sweat so stop discouraging people who are you to tell us what is right for us or not you trying to tell us give up go back renting easy for you to say it i dont think your lost your home your just making up your one of those haters so get lost and get a life to some people just dont give up so you have to respect them and mind your own business its between the struglling homeowners and the countrywide business is this this not your fight.
“this is not your fight”
Thats funny. If you only knew what I do for a living.
Good Luck to you Hans. Keep on “fighting”. I know I sleep much better at night now that Im not burdened with my 3300 dollar a month mortgage payment and 6000 a year property taxes that I cant afford. But hey you do you, k?
justasuggestion:
I am sorry that you fell into hard times. I am sorry that you lost your home… I have had to deal with a lot of different emotions as I am sure you have, but even with some of the anger I have inside I still chose to see the good in people and try to find solutions before giving up.
My husband & I too have gone to great lenghts not to fall behind with garage sales, selling personal furniture, borrowed from family & friends, cut back on everything. My son goes to daycare during the day while i work & my daughter goes to school & after school care. I was just trying to take your suggestion of a 2nd job for myself and explained the pros & cons of my particular situation.
my husband gets to sleep 5 hours a day at best between his night shifts & graveyard shifts.
MAYBE your solution is better … stop fighting, give up & move on …live here without the burden of the mtg pymt or taxes or insurance & blow everything out the window, lay down the towel and F**K all the hard years of work we put into it & wait for the foreclosure notice, might be lucky and get the foreclosure notice some time next year … maybe this solution would be less exhausting.
What do you exactly do for a living?
Or are you like some of the other bloggers here who come in on a high horse look down on the people who have fallen on bad times (i just hope they have a cushioned ass for whenever they fall) or like those people from the news story yesterday today who saw an old man get hit by 2 different cars & did nothing ???
I hope not.
That is why this world has gone to shit ! people have forgetten to treat their fellow man with compassion. If I was there and saw that happen I would have run to his aide, called 911 something, anything. I would not just have sat there and watch him bleed out or drive around him and keep on going. WTF has this world come to???
i don’t want pity, everyone is feeling it in one way or another & so have you. I just would like you to understand that I want to fight for my home and try every option. then & only then if none work – figure out another plan… but I don’t want to just throw in the towel when there are options out there that can prevent my family from losing our home, that’s all.
you did confuse me a bit on the last part of your post a bit contradicting
“My point is, we didnt expect the lender to clean up our mess. …… We stayed in contact with them, took every suggestion they offered, and lost it anyway”
if you didn’t expect the lender to clean up your mess, why did you stay in contact with them & take their suggestions?
I don’t expect them to clean up my mess… I am just asking if there is a possibility of a loan modification so that we may continue to pay our obligation to them & the investor and continue with our responsibility vs. all of us losing. If they say no & there are no other options then I will probably be in the same boat as you Renting after being a homeowner for many years… I truly wish you and your family the best and glad to have met you and heard your opinions and suggestions.
Respectfully,
Carrie
Lookinthemirror,
You know as well as I do the majority of people who are now underwater with their loans were all encouraged to go for it by the RE agent AND the Loan Officer. Why??? Because the RE agent and LO would get a commission for loaning out someone else’s money! The person asking the questions of the borrower is the first line of defense in a system designed to prevent fraud, period. Even if someone applied for a no doc and/or stated income loan, they still had to sign a piece of paper saying the company giving them a loan could look at previous tax records to determine their income. The failure of the LO or underwriter to do so is NOT the fault of the borrower. In fact, they were led to believe “everything will be great” by the Loan Officer.
Yes, the banks are taking huge writedowns, and in fact, will continue to do so for a few more years, due to their lack of adherence to guidelines. You only prove my point by stating this, that the lenders were also speculators in this mess. The homeowners who took out loans will be punished by paying money on a house they cannot possibly get back or by foreclosure or bankruptcy haunting their credit record. Yet, you fail to realize, it could have and should have been stopped by the Loan Officer, then by the underwriter.
The big banks knew they were causing an asset bubble, and they also knew they could not stop. When one monkey starts to do something, they all do it for fear of losing out on something. It was the same with risky loans. Once Countrywide began to loosen its guidelines, and gain marketshare, all the other lenders had to follow suit or lose their marketshare. It is that simple. Countrywide is only getting what it deserves. Its leaders should be forced to return all income to Fannie and Freddie for losses on loans Countrywide said were prime (and were not) and be made an example of (jail). The rest of the big banks will soon become a few, merging under forced circumstances due to losses that make them bankrupt (which many already are, hint “Level 3″ accounting).
Again, the rest of the blame is on the shoulders of the person asking the questions of the borrower. How many LO’s over the last 7 years have told someone getting an adjustable rate loan “I’m sorry, you can’t afford it”? How many LO’s and AE’s spent hours fighting underwriters to get someone approved? How many Lo’s and AE’s rationalized that they too deserved part of this bubble?
Lookinthemirror, you arguments ring hollow, for many borrowers were duped into thinking it would be OK by the very people who are suppose to be the “gatekeepers” of the money. I will be proven correct. Many Lo’s and AE’s and underwriters, even Real Estate agents, will be drug into court over the simple idea that their words created a false image that the borrower would be able to pay the loan back.
Rick, Carrie, Hans and all the other open minded, common sense and multi layer thinking people and commnentors on this blog.
THANKS!
You are a breathe of fresh air in a stench filled den of wolves.
It’s nice to know I am not alone in the fight for what is right.
Carrie,
Thank you for your response. We stayed in contact with the lender because we were trying to negotiate the short sale. It was at the lenders suggestion we lower the asking price when it was sitting on the market for months with no offers. Once we did that, buyer traffic started picking up and within 2 weeks, we had a buyer. Problem was, the lender refused to cancel the sale date to give themselves enough time to process our short sale package. Not sure why they did that, but they did.
I’ve been following thid blog for weeks, and have read youe posts. For some reason, I was under the impression you were still unemployed, so I apologise for my comment to you. What type of loan mod are you seeking from CW? Are you trying for a lower monthly payment? How much lower will it need to be in order for you to afford it? Our lender offered to put the back payments to the balance, however we knew we could no longer afford those payments, so that wouldnt work. We have taken a 75k per year pay cut between us. It just wasnt feasable. For us, a reduction in payment would mean “Uh yeah, can our payment be $600 a month INCLUDING taxes and insurance?” Not happening.
justasuggestion:
I am trying to get them to lower my interest rate from 7.5 % on the first to 5.5% and the 2nd loan is a 15yr interestonly balloon from 10.5% to 7.5%. then we can afford to continue to live here. I don’t know if this will happen. (FYI the final loan docs/program was not even close to what she offered us when we started the loan & never received the GFE’s)
From your experience what should we do?
since you have kids you probably understand how hard it is for me as their mother to look into their eyes & feel as if I have failed them in some way. Eventhough i played by the rules, saved money, built my credit and worked, paid my bills and raised our kids it doesn’t matter now. As a parent we are responsible to provide love, shelter and food.
After learning what I have learned here the past few weeks I feel I was taken advantage of to a certain point by my loanofficer/broker.
I mean we gave a big down payment, had months of reserves, developer was giving 6% seller concession, and our credit scores with in the mid 700’s and the loan officer told me we were a full doc loan. I don’t think this is true now. {any loan officer would have loved to have our file right?) any time she asked for a piece of paper it was sent to her within hours.
OH, & I still had to pay origination fee, discount point (because i was told discount point is to buy down the rate & the rates had gone up & she had to lock it in), & i was informed by a rep at CW they made a big YSP on both loans.
at closing i had to bring addtional $ for closing costs. From other brokers / bankers / uw who have posted here they have stated that I could have gotten a much better deal.
I just did not know how to negotiate that at the time and was misguided.
June will be the first month that we will not be able to make our payment. our property taxes have gone up to 6600, hazard to 2400 and flood to 1300. so maybe you & I are in the same boat.
it just sucks to give up the fight & throw in the towel with out giving every option everything you have.
Rick-
You wrote a lot in your blog that is nonsense. I will try to simplify things for you.
1. At the end of the day the person BORROWING the money owes it back. The protection that the bank has is a signed, recorded document called a NOTE and DEED of TRUST (in California, elsewhere it is a MORTGAGE CONTRACT).
2. If someone was physically forced to sign documents, or there was fraud, or forgery, than whomever perpetuated the fraud will eventually get caught and prosecuted. My guess is that is less that one-tenth of one percent of the problem.
3. The gatekeepers (LO’s, Underwriter’s, Bank’s, Rating’s firm’s, and purchaser’s of the “bad paper”) are now being punsished for the “easy credit” we have been experiencing. They are being punished by: a) loss of their job b) decline of their stock price c) bankruptcy of their company. This is what a capitalistic society calls “creative destruction”. It happens every day of the week.
4. The reason it is so bad right now, is that too many people succumbed to the marketing efforts, and “easy money” opportunities, and purchased more than they could afford. At the end of the day, they still owe the money. Any excuse in the world falls on deaf ear’s because of the fact that they signed a legal contract that was recorded.
5. There is no defensible position for people that took on too much debt unless it happened illegally. You make a point about the 4506 FORM to verify income. Many banks did not require that form during “easy money” times. If you haven’t been sleeping, they all (or a large percentage of the smart institutions) require them now.
It seems to me that you are one of the people that failed to Look in the Mirror after you leveraged yourself, and purchased a home above your means. This is a tough lesson to learn, but it will help you and your children not to live beyond your means in the future. DON’T GET CAUGHT IN THE DEBT TRAP…..RENT A HOME, OWN YOUR CAR……it is not that difficult!
Carrie,
I think, based on YOUR situation, you are doing the right thing in at least trying with the lender. Many many people who are caught up in all of this should have never gotten their home to begin with, put zero down and fuddled through their first 2 years by robbing Peter to pay Angelo, and now have thousands in unsecured debt, on top of an exploding payment. If you look that their financials, they are upside down on their monthly expenses MORE than their mortgage. They want their lender to give them a MOD, but the lender would have to pay them monthly, in order to create a surplus. They dont understand why the lender wont “just give them a lower payment”. While many on this blog will argue that its still the lenders fault for giving these people the loan to begin with, I can say I dont agree with that entirely. I dont think that you fall into this category. You are one that deserves to be helped, and I hope you get it.
Just dont dig your heels in so firmly that you are stuck at the bitter end with nowhere to go. Start looking at other options, thats all Im saying. Just incase. We had several months to find a new home and Im glad we had something set up when the time came.
It does sound like that LO did whatever she could to make the maximum amount of commission on your deal and you did get burned. The taxes and insurance alone on your home are what could make or break this. Can you also afford those on top of the payments?
As for your kids, I know what you mean. My daughter has been a trooper but I know she was confused by the whole situation. Since we lost our house, she has had a few friends go through the same thing, so at least she dosent feel like her parents are just losers. We have done everything we can to make sure her life dosent have to change drastically. We had to move 2 towns over ( cheaper) but we kept her in her same school and make sure she gets to do things socially whenever she asks.
I wish you the best, Carrie. It will be okay. Just remember that. No matter what happens you will all be ok. Even if you lose, you can buy again in 3 more years.
justasuggestion
THANK YOU !
Carrie, Moe, etc-
Theres no question (as I have stated 3 times now) that some borrowers lost their homes due to health problems, etc..that’s a given. This would have happened anyway. Circle of life stuff and all that. The problem with your mindset is that you are enabling many people to use the excuse that they were coerced or forced into loans. If given the choice between your home, family and lifestyle and claiming that you were unethically forced into a loan without knowledge of the parameters of the loan, what would you choose? This really muddies the waters of lending because ultimatley alot of people that chose to conduct themselves professionally are labled as thiefs and scumbags and this is simply not true. There has to be accountablity or otherwise you have a situation such as the insurance industry in which consumers took advantage of claims, lawsuits, etc. and consequently has raised premiums for everyone. It’s already happening in our industry. If you are a self employed business owner and you have to go stated, good luck. Regardless of credit score, assets, etc.
Theres no question that there are unethical mortgage salespeople in our industry, just like there is no question that the lion share of these consumers saw a chance to own a home, when they knew they shouldn’t, were given a chance and they f’ed it up. Look, I’m no Stephen Hawkins, but I know if I make $2k per mo and my mortgage is $1.5k per mo and I have other bills then I don’t need to own a home. If I can’t figure this out and my math is that bad then I don’t need to own a home either. It’s like going into Walmart with your last $20 and spending it all on candy when you need it to live on for the week. Is the cashier supposed to counsel you on the fiduciary responsiblity you have to yourself to spend that $20 more wisely? I know what you are going to say, $20 is different than $200k loan. Not really though. The concept is the same. A loan officers job is to get your loan closed, period. Now, if that LO unethically forges documents, juices apprasials, etc. then all bets are off.
Bottomline, if you give people an excuse to get a free ride, than they will do such. It’s human nature. I’ve been in management is some fashion for twenty years and have dealt with thousands of personalities. You have to think of the bigger picture down the road and whats best for everyone overall.
Moe, my guess is that you are making a ton of money off of remodifications, restructuring, etc. My questions is: what’s the difference?
Have a great day.
Kelly-
I didn’t notice your post until now. Let me respond:
I am located in Atlanta, GA, but I have dealt with homeowners across the country and consequently many areas that are depreciating nationwide. Specifically, FL, where home prices have taken as much of a beating as in SOCAL. I think you are misinterpreting the post a bit. You cannot fix a serious problem unless you are able to diagnose what the true issue really is. Blaming brokers and lenders is pretty easy because alot of people made some serious money in the last 5-7 years from the mortgage business and they’re an easy target because everyone assumes that they are all retired with plenty of money in the bank and on a island somewhere. I think there are many reasons why this implosion happened and I think that in order to fix the problem, everyone (including irresponsible borrowers) have to be included in the solution.
Lets say for example your bank called you one day and said that for one day only they were giving away $200k and that all you had to do was come down and sign some paperwork. So you head down to the bank and discover that in order to recieve the $200k you had to pay it back if you ever won the lottery, inherited the money, etc. You read through the documentation and it clearly states all of the above. You get your money and move on. One day you inherit $200K, the bank finds out and asks to be paid back. The problem is that you spent the money on a new car, house, etc and you have overextended yourself in credit cards and you need the inheritance money to pay these items off. So…you tell the bank there not geting Sweet FA and move on…you get where I’m going with this.
1) You should have been willing to pay it back before you signed
2)If you weren’t willing to accept responsiblity you should not have signed
3)Even though it’s painful, you man up and pay it back
My point is that the mortgage industry hasn’t changed that much in the past twenty years, sure the programs opened up a little bit, but back in the nineties 125% loans were not uncommon at all, yet, we did not have anything like this. The broker business had plenty of slick salespeople, etc. back then I promise. Wallstreet and a lack of accountablity from borrowers, declining home prices and greedy salespeople ALL contributed. The solution? It’s already happening, its called MARKET CORRECTION. The smarter and knowledgeable will survive and the uneducated and ignorant will fail. It’s not my fault and it’s not your fault, it’s just a fact.
Frank-
I am sorry, your blog comment will have to be revised. You did not use nearly enough exclamation points, swear words and didnt once point your finger at someone.
Tighten it up a little. This is a website for whiney $30,000/year high school grads who are mad that they cant afford the gas in their leased BMW.
Nicely done, Frank. They won’t listen, though. They are koolaid drinkers and no amount of reasoning will penetrate that fog.
Frank-
You get it! Finally, someone willing to cut through the excuses, nonsense, and lack of personal responsibility. Nice job, AND you have taken a Look in the Mirror!!! Great posts!!!
Hopefully, we can come sort of solution to this housing downturn, but it all starts with taking responsibility for our actions, and not blaming others for our misfortunes (as most people on this blog seem to want to do!!!!)
Wait a minute. I don’t blame everybody! I just to choose to blame Bush. It’s a 100 degrees here today and my windshield crack keeps getting longer – I know damn well it’s George W’s fault. My mother passed away Memorial Day and, even though I haven’t found the exact connection, I know he did that too.
What is trackback??? Is that someone who thinks they have all the answers for people who made poor decisions??? I am very concerned that many in our country have lost all sense of what is right and wrong. This may be the tipping point…..here is some really good advice.
1. If you can not afford payments on a depreciating asset, sell it NOW
2. You may want to sell some of your stock portfolio, and purchase inflation hedges.
If this makes no sense to you, than PLEASE connect with a financial planner or someone who has a large net worth, and no debt that can give you some constructive feedback as to your situation.
Finally, the Washington Post has come out with the article. And now blogging people, I am vindicated (because it’s all about me, not Moe), and I laugh at you. The liberal experiment is over:
“In 2004, regulators warned that subprime lenders were saddling borrowers with mortgages they could not afford, the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development helped fuel more of that risky lending.
Eager to put more low-income and minority families into their own homes, the agency required that two government-chartered mortgage finance firms purchase far more “affordable” loans made to these borrowers. HUD stuck with an outdated policy that allowed Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae to count billions of dollars they invested in subprime loans as a public good that would foster affordable housing.
Housing experts and some congressional leaders now view those decisions as mistakes that contributed to an escalation of subprime lending that is roiling the U.S. economy.”
Shorty has the bag…..now the cat is out.
The affordable housing (code for-low-moderate income)initatives were the first stated income programs and the first to allow ridiculous super high back end ratios. Normal back end ratios were 38-42% these programs would sometimes approve 65-70% ratios….what is left to pay everything else??
People bash CW but they were one of the first working close with fannie mae to market and sell all these “great” affordable housing programs.
Another program iniative- “emerging markets’ code for emigrants- legal or otherwise. follow the money on this one—CW was big in CA before anywhere else. This program was basically the first “no doc” program. Very lax… i mean liberal UW standards indeed and almost no verification. Here is the the best part… CW used to hold conf room seminars with catering for RE agents and brokers to educate and how to “sell” this program.
I remember one of the speakers for CW boasting that he made more than most MD’s using these programs….
this was in 1999-2000. This debacle was just getting kick started.
see mozillo’s picture?
see how his pinky is off to the side? this is a sign. This is the sign given to denote his membeship in a society.
This is the sign one member gives to another member to garner support when under public scrutiny.
This man will not be indicted….
Penny is a Pig…Her family is a bunch of money grubbing thieving slobs\’e2\’80\’a6She fits right in with the Democrats\’e2\’80\’a6The good old US of A is in grave danger. It appears that the Candidates are borderline criminals, and they are aided and abetted by pure criminals\’e2\’80\’a6The common middle-class tax payer is doomed\’e2\’80\’a6
May I clarify\’e2\’80\’a6I mean both candidates are borderline criminals\’e2\’80\’a6Who is looking out for America?
it is a scary thought there Stephen — i don’t know what will happen in this election. we need to choose the lesser of 2 evils & pray !
is it ever any different in any election? it seems we are always having to choose the lesser evil…..
It shouldn’t be fair that just Obama’s camp is checked out for quailty people.
Apply the same standards to McCain and his group and they would have to withdrawal from the race! I guess McCain would have to divorce his wife as well for making money in the mortgage industry. Remember the Keating 5 folks.
Am I reading this wrong or are you a strong McCain supporter? I don’t see anything here about the money grubbing folks McCain surrounds himself with. Several would still be with him if they had not been exposed already. Is Obama guilty by association of “Predatory” lending or of a poor job of vetting by those in his organization?
I think that the emphasis of your anger should be focused more on Penny and less on Barack Obama. It’s time to stop the personal attacks and lies, including those directed at Michelle Obama, and get back to what this election is supposed to be about. Let\’e2\’80\’99s talk about policy differences. Has anyone heard the Obama people say a disparaging word about Mrs. McCain??? Perhaps she is a Saint?
A large number of families in this country are living in homes with \’e2\’80\’9csubprime\’e2\’80\’9d loans and making their mortgage payments in spite of having bad credit histories.
By the way I am a registered republican.
I am not a McCain supporter. I am undecided at the moment. But, I cant and you shouldn’t ignore the fact that Obama is dishing out speeches with words that may be snookering the American people.
He sometimes lashes out at the people, corporations and CEO’s for the same thing that Penny Pritzker has been accused of and “practically” convicted for.
When I say practically, I mean, money can practically buy and get you out of anything. Including snookering the people in the very same community which Obama lived and Pritzker’s bank preyed.
What more facts do you all need?
Does Penny Pritzker own Transunion Credit Reporting Agency? These agencies’ keep our credit scores low, so banks can charge more interest. Does anyone know if the consumer reporting agencies are somehow conneced to the stock and bond rating companies??
It seems like snookering bank and S&L shareholders is something that rich people with political connections do on a regular basis. I believe that if you go back to 1989 you will find that the biggest loss that the RTC (US Government) took was with Silverado Savings out of Colorado that involved GHW Bush’s son our current President’s brother. Regards Errol
Gatorbait are you part of that secret society? are you working undercover for Mozillo?
and as for Shorty Wanna Thug on Jun 11th, 2008 at 10:09 am
did you read that article????? they are flat out saying that the banks were doing wrong by saddling borrowers with mortgages they could not afford….
Now if someone came to borrow money from you and you knew that they probably were not going to be able to pay you back but they signed a promissary note for you, would you still lend it?
NO i wouldn’t have taken that risk, that is exactly what the greedy banks, and the rest of them did… took advantage of all the tools they had to fill their pockets with more & more money $$$$$$ while the borrowers are left holding the bag.
the borrower did not push the appraiser to up the value ( i’m sure the borrower would have much rather had a lower value to pay less) the borrower did not tell the UW to look the other way & fund their loan, the borrrower DID however ask for guidance and the expertise of their mortgage broker to guide them in this financial decision since they are the ‘expert’ in their field (yeah right) now for all those few good, ethical, morally correct, and hardworking mtg brokers – they – the good ones are paying the price of all the bad apples who are probably now parking cars.
hey pist…i know a skull and bones sign when i see it..if i could shake his hand then i would know for sure….
anyway that has been my point…the banks and the govt are basically in this together so i get a chuckle when everyone wants the govt to come down hard on the very agencies they pushed to boost housing. The public was saddled with this mess when the initiatives were put into place. All the grant money that was offered out…CRA incentives…FHA money to rehab properties… come on the govt was pushing heavily for increased home ownership since 2001 to look good. I remember the state of the unions— bush took credit “more Americans are proud homeowners now than in an period in our country’s history” yea…ok. All these initiatives forced the values up dramatically. It just was not supposed to end this soon.
The S&L events all over again.
The front line scapegoats are small potatoes… just pawns..Anytime easy money is put on the table you will see a bunch or crooks step up….there were plenty of ethical MB/LO’s who would in fact inform the borrower of the new tax bill they were about to get hit with if they purchased the brand new shiny home…and ask if they are prepared for the new payment 1 or 2 years down the road when this payment kicks in.
guess who would then get slapped for “scaring” the buyer. RE agents, builders, who opened up their own shops to prevent the mortgage professional from potentially tanking their deals.
I know there is a lot of bashing of the mortgage programs sold but in fact in many instances payments jumped up because of the taxes and insurance increases and the shortages in the escrow accounts to pay these items.
Just wait and see how many FoA’s there were lurking in the halls of the regulatory agencies. Look at the guys now putting together the “new” policies.
I know there are some on these posts who want to pin a label on anyone who turns on the light to the bigger picture. But to point the spotlight on only a select few is exactly what those who started this fire are hoping for and count on.
Again the game is bigger than just countrywide and some mortgage brokers/LO’s…. follow the money…..follow who actually benefited…the most from the increased home ownership…that is who you want to burn at the stake…
the industry was not just pushed..it was basically encouraged to hand out money…who took credit for the economic boom for that period??
it really is very simple….
Hey CarDam… you said:
“take your nasty comments and judgemental butt back to school.
you are judging people and making assumptions
you know what they say when you assume
you make an ASS of U —– grow some pubic hairs, learn to respect others hardships before uttering your garbage”
There is another one who does what you claim above to anyone who disagrees with him ….and he gets chants of “you rock” “you have balls” and he uses Nazi analogies…..
Shorty..keep on keeping it on …. you rock…
I love hans…what box did you check for citizenship on page 3?
apparently there is another secret society- “modification hijackers”
I wish everyone who is having difficulty the best of luck and can get things worked out….
THE FEDERAL AND STATE AGENCIES CRACK DOWN ON FORECLOSURE AND MODIFICATION SCAM] ….ONE OF THE BIGGEST SCAM MODIFICATION COMPANY OUT THERE… AMBER MCCLAIN IS AT 7555 IRVINE CENTER DRIVE ,IRVINE, CA 92618#1…GLENN A. BADGETT IS AT #2 21600 OXNARD STREET, SUITE 1700 WOODLAND HILLS,CA 911367….THE NAME OUTSIDE THE #2 OFFICE IS.. FIRST FINANCIAL LENDING GROUP,INC .. BILL ANZ FOUNDING PARTNER OF FEDERAL LOAN MODIFIACTION LAW CENTER…BILL ANZ 20 O/O OF 5.OOO CUSTOMERS IS NOTTHING.PS .. IF THE GOVERNMENT IS CRACKING DOWN ON MORTGAGE SCAMS .AND CUSTOMERS HOMES THAT WAS NOT MODIFY ON BEHALF OF BILL ANZ [FEDERAL LOAN MODIFICANTION LAW CENTER ] AND THERE HOME WAS SOLD OR NOT.AND BILL ANZ CUSTOMERS ARE WORKING .BILL ANZ SHOULD BUY ALL THE HOME BACK.AND BECOME THE LOAN SERVE …..THANK YOU
What is going to be done about all these negative home loans? When are homes going to be modified back to the fair market value.